Some rabid Falun Gong followers show their ugly side in Flushing, NY
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Case in point, there are reports of FLG followers publicly cheering the Sichuan earthquake as a karmic response from heaven on the Chinese Communist Party. ESWN provided a translation of a report from Ming Pao dated May 21, 2008:
The confrontation between Queens county residents and the FLG practitioners is now on its fourth day …
Yesterday at 10am, several dozen FLG member appeared in front of the Flushing Public Library. Just like the past three days before, they unfurled banners that pronounced “The Heavens destroy the Chinese Communists,” “Experts sent Sichuan earthquake prediction report confidentially to authorities” and so on to show the passer-bys. Some of the FLG members said that they have been criticising the Chinese Communist regime and they thought that the Sichuan earthquake revealed the evil nature of the Chinese Communists. Some FLG members even said that the Sichuan earthquake was the result of the violent rule of the Chinese Communists.
…
The New Voice also had an entry. Please note that some FLG supporters disputed the nature of the confrontation in the comment section. I find it difficult, however, to interpret the “天滅中共” (Heaven is destroying the CCP) signs so prominently displayed by the FLG protesters as anything other than their perspective on the Sichuan earthquake. This understanding is further supported by another commenter and eye witness named
… I live in Jamaica, New York, about two miles from the Flushing library where the protest took place and this report originated. I can absolutely confirm that the Falun Gong practitioners were gleeful about the earthquake. It was a pretty stupid thing for the FG to do. There were lots of angry people in the streets; angry at the Falun Gong for kicking China when its down. Who can blame them. It was a boneheaded thing to do.
I won’t bother to argue it is wrong and despicable to invoke God or heaven in explaining the happening of the Sichuan earthquake as many have already touched on this topic. (e.g. see “What have they done to deserve this?” at Sun Bin) As Mr. Hillgardner put it, “it was a pretty stupid thing for the FLG to do.”
Perhaps there could be a silver lining to this event. Surely there would be a large number of reports in the newspapers of this multi-day and ongoing confrontation involving large number of people and police in New York, which is one of the best covered regions in the world, news media wise. And maybe, just maybe, some of the habitual criticizers of China would read about such behaviors of the rabid FLG followers, look into their beliefs and acts, and take a more nuanced view of CCP vs. FLG in the future. Right?
However, this is not going to happen since they won’t be able to read about it anywhere, except, on the Epoch Times, which happens to be the propaganda arm of the FLG and where this confrontation is described as another case of CCP paid agents harrasing peaceful FLG protesters. Seriously, try typing in “Falun Gong Flushing” or some other variations in the Google News Search and see what you get.
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May 22nd, 2008 at 4:35 am
FLG do get lots of kind hearted people beleive FLG practicer in China get executed just because of the belief and their organ get harvested. many reads and believes the stories on
Epoch Times.
FLG is well financed and organized but certainly not by Li HongZhi.
May 22nd, 2008 at 4:45 am
Don’t forget the Youtube video also linked from ESWN:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y78iaMm2I7s
Most of those interviewed are saying things along the lines of … “FLG is inhumane, they actually banged on gongs and celebrated the earthquake on Saturday”.
I do not have much opinion about FLG as a “religion”, because I’m not educated on the spiritual aspects. But I will say my personal experience with its political activities in the years after the Communist crackdown has just been… disgusting, disturbing.
I personally know some FLG practictioners, a few of whom are active in the movement itself. I know they’re not evil people, and they might fervently believe that what they’re doing is appropriate as a way of fighting back against the Communist government… but their methods have failed. They’ve done more to turn the Chinese community against them than anything Beijing could do.
May 22nd, 2008 at 4:52 am
FLG practitioners’ unpalatable speech does not in any way improve the CCP’s case for outlawing FLG in China. Is that what you are trying to suggest by a “silver lining?” When you say, people should “look into their beliefs,” do you mean that if the “west” just knew more it would concur that they are in fact an “evil cult” as labeled by the CCP? I have found FLG practitioners to be a bit out there, but they have shown nothing that in any way merits the persecution that has been their lot in the last ten years. What more nuance do you want than that? By the way, thanks for your attempt to break their monopoly on media coverage of the incident.
May 22nd, 2008 at 5:07 am
for me ,the video just shows the anti-CCP and pro-CCP protesters
May 22nd, 2008 at 5:22 am
“some of the FLG followers make it really difficult to sympathize with their cause.”
As if you sympathized with their cause before this incident… fangpi!
May 22nd, 2008 at 5:44 am
Mr. Ma,
Please note that I purposely didn’t take a position on Chinese government’s treatment of FLG in this entry.
Similar to Buxi, I have nothing against FLG as a religion per se. But I am put off by actions of some of their more fervent believers outside of China. Some of the things are merely “amusing”, such as their claim that more than 35 million, and counting, CCP members have quit as the result of their campaign. Some of the things are not exactly laughing matters. Have you heard of their insistent but discredited charge that the CCP systematically arrested, tortured and harvested organs from FLG practitioners in China.
So by “silver lining” I do not mean it should or would improve CCP’s case for outlawing FLG. Rather I would like to see those “concerned” politicians, opinion makers and activists no longer treat FLG vs. CCP as a simple case of good vs. evil. I am not asking much for a “nuanced” view in this case, am I? But sadly I find such appeal actually necessary.
May 22nd, 2008 at 6:28 am
Dear DJ,
I don’t give credence to the most outlandish of the FLG newspaper reports. And I don’t think much of the foreign media does either. I’ve heard about the 35 million people leaving the party, organ harvesting, etc. When the FLG press reports on those things they completely discredit themselves. The fact that they don’t recognize how foolish some of these things sound leads me in part to believe that they are a bit “out there.” The question is not whether they are pure “good” (as opposed to pure evil), but whether or not goofy but innocuous spiritual groups have a right to believe what they wish. In this sense, the CCP policy is loathsome. Wouldn’t you agree? This point, I believe, doesn’t require much nuance.
May 22nd, 2008 at 6:30 am
Personal attacking is just distasteful on a blog to share views
May 22nd, 2008 at 6:51 am
overseaschinese,
You may be surprised that I do sympathize with many of the people who were caught between FLG vs. CCP.
My father-in-law told me once about a guy in his DanWei (work unit) who wasn’t in good health and joined FLG group to practice its variant of QiGong (a form of therapeutic movement, breathing, and meditation). He was heavily pressured by the bureaucrats in the DanWei to renounce FLG after the government decided to crackdown on it in 1999. He did not deserve the trouble and I sympathize with him.
I assume that there were many people in FLG for the same health consideration in the 90’s. I also assume that there were many members simply looking for spiritual guidance and found so in FLG. Frankly I see some of the teachings and believes in FLG as far fetched. But who am I to tell others what to or not to believe? Either way, they were innocents and I don’t doubt that many of them were similarly harassed. Some perhaps experienced worse. (But I simply refuse to believe the BS about them being tortured and organ harvested.) I sympathize with them.
That said, I am nevertheless disturbed by the actions and words of some more rabid FLG followers in the US I have seen or heard. With regard to this Flushing incident, I will repeat my rather understated comment: some of the FLG followers make it really difficult to sympathize with their cause.
May 22nd, 2008 at 6:59 am
Mr. Ma,
In principle, I don’t disagree with you. However, I think the problem, as of today instead of 1999, is that FLG is perhaps no longer a “goofy but innocuous spiritual group” any more.
RE: “I don’t give credence to the most outlandish of the FLG newspaper reports. And I don’t think much of the foreign media does either.” But what if some of the foreign media and some of their readers do? And I suspect that it is not necessarily a small percentage.
May 22nd, 2008 at 7:29 am
FLG is just an avenue for people to claim political asylum status towards getting their Green Card.
May 22nd, 2008 at 10:12 am
I used to have sympathy for those FLG followers, but after the incident where they verbally attacked and maliciously slandered ordinary Chinese students in a very vicious way at LSE(London School Economics) in London, I just think they are way too crazy.
May 22nd, 2008 at 11:03 am
亲爱的overseaschinese,
从您的其他留言得知您在中国教过书，应该称您为老师了。
在这里，中外人士在友好热烈的气氛中交换意见。fangpi一词显得有些突兀，有损师雅，有辱师尊。请老师明鉴。
May 22nd, 2008 at 4:38 pm
Of course, everyone here realizes that FLG is finance by the CIA and other secret parts of the US government so that the US can repeated site it as an issue against China, right?
May 22nd, 2008 at 4:48 pm
This blog is certainly showing its panda licking colors by saying that only the FLG believes that the earthquakes are a sign that the CCP has lost the mandate from heaven.
May 22nd, 2008 at 6:13 pm
I do sympathize with individual Falun Gong practitioners forced to give up their religion. I think the Chinese people should have the right to their faith, within legal reason. (Many Chinese are concerned with the faith-healing aspects of FLG, for example.)
There are a thousand other quirky, similar religions throughout China. I don’t like many of them on a personal basis, but I don’t think the government should deny them to the people.
But China has a great fear of organized religions, and I personally can understand why. The Taiping Rebellion wasn’t all that long ago. FLG clearly became something more than just a religious faith when it took its activism to the streets in China.
When FLG faithful show up in great numbers when ordered to harass scientists and journalists who criticize the religion (this is all before the crackdown), something is wrong. When FLG faithful show up in great numbers on the same day in order to harass government offices, something is very wrong.
In a more perfect world, in a China that has an established legal order, we could depend on the legal system to manage this. Those who break the law by assembling illegally would be charged openly and tried fairly. Those who break the law by preventing others from seeking medical help would also be charged openly and tried fairly. But that legal system doesn’t exist in China now. I think much of the ill in Chinese society can be traced back to that.
May 22nd, 2008 at 10:13 pm
Religious nuts exist in the west and they are a nuisance. As long as laws regarding their freedom of speech and their targets’ freedom of safety and speech are equally respected and enforced there is no problem.
If Beijing wants China to be respected as a Great Power than the government and the individual people are going to have to learn to accept things they hear and don’t agree with both domestically and internationally.
Basically, the government has to stop throwing temper tantrums at home and the Chinese people have to stop throwing temper tantrums abroad.
May 23rd, 2008 at 12:10 am
@nanheyangrouchuan,
I am glad to see your less angry words of “If Beijing wants China to be respected as a Great Power than the government and the individual people are going to have to learn to accept things they hear and don’t agree with both domestically and internationally” than something you posted on shanghailist like ” Burn down the Forbidden shit”
I agree with this and this has caused a lot of trouble. FLG is just one of the example. FLG people could not accept the scientist’s criticizing while the same scientist who also criticized other similar practices and FLG people massed gathered in the university and surrounded the government buildings used to be part of the buildings you shouted to burn down. And the CCP could not take FLG’s showing off like this and caused the crackdown.
CCP and many Chinese people never live in a democracy environment and have more to learn. CCP leaders educated in the 50s,60s under Soviet style system and few of them could read English and never been taught about the good western values, it’s hard for them to change over night. Taiwan’s democracy only happened after the death of Chiang Kai-shek and his son. These two were same with CCP leaders in terms of both under dictatorship or war environment and have no much ideal of democracy. Democracy has a long way to go in China and would get there by all the peaceful means but not by the violence like ” Burn down the Forbidden shit” you suggested and your ancestors did it.
putting the photo of PLA soldiers disguised as Tibetan monks on the front page might be creative but not very constructive criticizing to CCP or some Chinese people you hate.
May 23rd, 2008 at 2:22 am
Dont be riducluas Falun Gong would never cheer the deaths of any person. This is an outright lie ognasied by teh Ccp to attack FAlun Gong’s good reputation. No one in teh west wiht a free mind would beleive that. Instead read this..
CCP interferes and urges Chinese nationalist to attack Falun Gong peaceful appeals outside of China
Peaceful Rally Attacked in New York City’s Chinatown
Chinese regime believed to order attack
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-19/70825.html
“The attack on the rally seems to have been coordinated with Chinese-language media that are controlled or influenced by the CCP. These media outlets, such as CCTV, ordinarily do not cover rallies held to urge people to quit the CCP.
On Saturday, these media outlets were present in force. Immediately after the event ended, they published and broadcast stories whose themes were that the participants in this rally “do not care about the victims of the Sichuan earthquake” and “do not love China.”
Witnesses at the scene saw individuals providing drinks and Chinese flags to the crowd that gathered to oppose the rally for quitting the CCP. Other individuals worked to arrange the scene to provide CCTV with good opportunities for filming.”
Organized Crowds in Chinatown Repeatedly Harass ‘Quit CCP’ Center
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-20/70827.html
Chinese Regime Tries to Quash Dissent in New York’s Chinatown, Say Activists http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-21/70866.html
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-21/70877.html
Overseas Chinese Students Harass Quit CCP Center in Japan
This was printed in the CCTV news in China a few days ago.
http://news.wenxuecity.com/messages/200805/news-gb2312-605101.html
Please view part translation of an article from CCP media spreading inside China. This has been forwarded to New York Police and other authorities for further investigation and possible evidence to stop these interferences in peaceful FG appeals outside of China.
This attack in Flushing, with the interpretation given it by regime-influenced Chinese-language media, appears to be an attempt to play on the strong feelings evoked by the disastrous earthquake in Sichuan in order to stigmatize opposition to the Chinese regime.
CCTV Article
“Global Times report: When many overseas Chinese were in sorrow of the Wenchuan earthquake and collecting donations, FLG people held a series of gathering in New York, trying to stop local Chinese communities and groups to collect donations for the earthquake. Many local Chinese were very angry.
According to a US Chinese website report, on 17th, FLG gathered in front of Flushing library in New York, in the event of earthquake in China, many Chinese people died or injured, FLG people betting drums, and saying that the disaster is related to politics of China.. Passers bys who was donating money can not forbear this and more and more people gathered there and protect to them. Two days later, FLG gathered in the same place again. People gathered and protect once more. The Chinese people at the site said that in the disaster of the nation, FLG want to link the disaster with politics, we Chinese people can not accept it. Chinese people shout out loud ” Go China” etc. Many people can not hold their anger and speak out to denounce FLG, they said even they’re all Chinese, but FLG didn’t donate money, on the contrary, the said these words, this is totally contradict to their ZSR. This is unacceptable to all Chinese people.”
Falun Gong were not stopping people from donating to the earthquake victims. In fact we were holding our Tuidang site and encouraging people to quit the Ccp. About 400 Chinese nationalists surrounded the group at Flushing in NY and began to swear and hit out at the FG. The Chinese nationalists have become emboldened from the protesting at Olympic Torch relays and the Ccp playing other anger at the loss of their families life from the earthquake. Please see Falun Dafa Info Centre from NY
Aftershocks: Chinese Mobs Incited to Attack Falun Gong in New York, Elsewhere
http://www.faluninfo.net/downloads/FDI_Press/FDI-080521-FL.htm
May 23rd, 2008 at 3:42 am
@Jana,
glad to see you are here.
Are you able to approve your claims on Richard Spencer’s blog are true? So I can learn more about the evil CCP.
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/foreign/richardspencer/march2008/tibetbiascutsbothways.htm#comments
Sorry I cross quote your words without your permission. I can request site admin to remove them if you don’t like I grab your words here
—————Jana’s post starts—————
Is there a regime more ghastly than that of the People’s Republic of China?
Jana 30 Mar 2008 06:43
Is there any other government that so systematically suppresses all religious liberty, erecting religious bureaucracies to which believers are required to belong in order to worship?
Is there any other regime that still imprisons and kills bishops, priests and monks who fail to swear loyalty to the state?
Is there any other country where the entire population is subject to child-bearing control, with forced sterilization and abortions for those who decline to submit to state rules on family size?
Is there any other regime that executes thousands of its citizens annually, the majority for the crime of challenging the ruling party?
Is there any other country accused (by credible sources) of executing the Falun Gong and harvesting their organs and selling them? Is there any other regime more dependable in its support of the worst kind of evil around the world (Darfur)?
Even the vile regimes in Saudi Arabia, Cuba, North Korea and Zimbabwe do not compare to China across the breadth of its human rights violations.
The question is whether China’s size and growing prosperity mean that all this has to be ignored. The answer the world has given has generally been yes. There is business to be done, and political leaders are there to facilitate that, human rights be damned.
So dont tell me the western media is biased and hates China because they have all being ignoring these violations up to date.
The Ccp will fall, its terminally ill and in its death throws.
————Jana’s post ends—————–
May 23rd, 2008 at 6:00 am
do you guys want to write something regarding ’spiritual movement’?
i mean, FLG regard themselves as a religion (or qigong group, i don’t know). dl lama and his followers definitely see themselves as buddhists.
yet the Mainstream media stubbornly insist to classify them as ’spiritual movement’. i was puzzled every time i see this word. a friend suggested the MSM (or people from these ‘movements’) may want to make this more acceptable the christian majority in the western world? maybe you guys can do some research on this.
what is the real difference between a religion, a sect, and a ‘movement’?
May 23rd, 2008 at 6:06 am
sun bin,
I don’t hav time for that, I’m still trying to find out the Western media’s definition of a “peaceful protest”…
May 23rd, 2008 at 6:12 am
@ shannxibiangbiangmian
I feel all warm and fuzzy inside now. But the picture of the PLA soldiers in Tibetan monk robes stays. Just because CCTV says it is a something else means nothing and in fact reinforces the theory. Especially when CCTV was there to film “monks” knocking down the doors of Han businesses. How convenient.
The picture of Mao certainly needs to burn, and his tomb as well.
May 23rd, 2008 at 6:26 am
BIng Ma, Please see these sites as they will show you what the real nature of the communist regime is.
Links to Why is Falun Gong persecuted in China?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqyI5s3WoM&feature=related
An Independent Investigation into Allegations of Harvesting of Falun Gong practitioners in China
http://organharvestinvestigation.net/
Coalition to Investigate the Persecution of Falun Gong in China (CIPFG
http://www.cipfg.org/en/
Falun Gong Human Rights Working Group
http://www.flghrwg.net/
The Falun Dafa Information Centre
http://faluninfo.net/
Falun Gong “Disappearing by Thousands”
by Georgianne Neiaber
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/georgianne-nienaber/beijing-olympics-is-us-su_b_95934.html
Here is a site on what is Falun Gong AKA Falun Dafa
http://www.falundafa.org/eng/home.html
Here is an independent verification and study from Professor Ownby
http://www.ruf.rice.edu/~tnchina/commentary/ownby1000.html
Misconceived thoughts about Falun Gong
http://www.david-kilgour.com/2008/Mar_21_2008_03.htm
Staged False Immolation in Tiananmen Square exposed –
http://www.clearwisdom.net/emh/special_column/self-immolation.html
Gao Zhisheng’s third open letter to Hu Jintao and Wen Jiabao
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/5-12-16/35876.html
http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070921/NATION/109210069
http://en.epochtimes.com/211,107,,1.html
Falun Gong Humanity’s Last Stand
http://www.falunhr.org/newsletter/TheLastStand.pdf
YOu might like to also read The Epoch Times book “The Nine Commentaries” which is an expose of the last 60 years of communist rule in China with 80 million un-natural deaths of Chinese people by the communist regime.
This book has been responsible for 37 million resignations from the ccp and its affiliated organisations since 2004.
http://ninecommentaries.com/
May 23rd, 2008 at 6:34 am
sun bin,
You certainly made an interesting suggestion. Coincidentally, I was just reading up the discussion of the term “cult” on Wikipedia an hour ago because of the same thought. I probably won’t be able to write anything on this though, given how big this project seems to be.
May 23rd, 2008 at 7:07 am
@fenqing nanheyangrouchuan
It’s wonderful to learn from you about “Just because CCTV says it is a something else means nothing and in fact reinforces the theory. Especially when CCTV was there to film “monks” knocking down the doors of Han businesses. How convenient.”
You would be many ’s hero and would write the history if you just go to Tiananmen and burn Mao’s picture and tomb. just make some petrol bomb and put them into your backpack would do the historical mission.
I’ll be always here and waiting for your moment.
May 23rd, 2008 at 5:14 pm
@ fenqing shannxibiangbiangmian
Anything I can do to broaden your mind! And that one was free btw.
May 23rd, 2008 at 6:04 pm
Enough already. No more personal sniping back and forth. We’re here to discuss China, not nanheyangrouchuan. Any more gets deleted.
May 23rd, 2008 at 10:29 pm
Jana,
You links are meaningless and full of lies, who the @#$% believe Epoch ? a complete joke !
Think of that, a religion that can make people forget his/her nationality, Is that a religion anymore ? it is just a brainwashing machine.
Human Right ? give me a break, your so called religion wont allow any doubt, let alone criticism.
You can keep bashing chinese government which is supported by 99% of the chinese, dont foolishly argue about that. The earthquake proved how much people believe in these government : people in misery just sat there and waited for the help of PLA and government.
Keep spouting those BS, no Chinese give a F#$%.
May 23rd, 2008 at 10:48 pm
BTW, I live in New York, The story is 100% true. did you see the balloons in the tape ? WTF did those goner need balloons for ?
The other day, one Falun goner even asked the organizer of donation group why he collected money for CCP.
May 23rd, 2008 at 11:40 pm
Buxi makes me feel not so special…
May 24th, 2008 at 6:40 am
Re Ha Ha,
you said “The other day, one Falun goner even asked the organizer of donation group why he collected money for CCP.”
Here is why the Falun Gong practitoenr asked you this question.
Question :Ask you self why the rich and famous people in China have not given as generously as the poor people in China?
Answer: The rich people know where the money is going—into the pockets of the corrupted Ccp.
Distrust Over Donated Relief Funds
Voice of America
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-22/70909.html
Chinese writer and critic Zhao Dagong said he believes there is a reason behind the negligible donations from billionaires, and the Chinese state-controlled media would not dare to expose it.
“I don’t think China’s billionaires aren’t willing to donate. The question is to whom should the donations be made? Will this money get to the disaster victims? Can China set up civilian charitable organizations? The Chinese Communist Party (CCP) monopolizes charitable organizations. Since all these donations have been made to it [the CCP], how will it be spent when the CCP is rife with corrupted officials?”
Mr. Zhao said that he and his colleagues had made donations for disaster relief; but he wasn’t sure how much of the monies would actually get to the victims. He said that even if one tenth of their donations reach the people in need he would consider that good.
Hong Kong Chi Heng Foundation Secretary Du Cong said that many Chinese felt compelled to make a donation after seeing news reports about the crisis, but whether they will continue to make donations depends on how the money is used.
May 24th, 2008 at 9:06 pm
Jana,
Dont give me the Epoch crap.
I visited Epoch website once and only once in March, it makes me vomit.
In a group of picture in Tibet in March, two pictures were obviously taken at the same place, but Epoch claimed one was in Lhasa, the other in Gansu.
A letter published on Epoch, by a “dissident” to US congress, claimed that Chinese want human right, not Olympic, WTF ?
BTW, Falun goners have been celebrating in Flushing, NY everyday since last week. Humanity ? BS !!!
May 25th, 2008 at 1:57 am
Jana if you think that praising the deaths of fifty thousand and blaming china which is thousands of miles away for the protests against you’re cult then there is a really big problem here. Epoch times and NTDTV is from falun gong members so i wouldn’t even trust them.
I don’t know what you and your cult was trying to prove in Flushing by saying about how china didn’t care about their people, you probably haven’t seen the PLA struggling to find survivors in sichuan. But the hundreds of chinese young and old didn’t act kind to your lies in the week.
May 25th, 2008 at 1:15 pm
I have just returned to the US from China. I was in Chengdu during the earthquke and assisted with rescue and recovery efforts in Beichuan and a refugee camp in Xiaoba and a what used to be a small villige nearby. Before the FLG continues to crow about the Chinese government they should be thinking about the innocent victims, the dead children and the millions without homes. I will remember the trucks full of body bags coming out of the Beichuan school for the rest of my life. Hopefully I will remember FLG not at all.
May 25th, 2008 at 4:15 pm
Chris Tuey,
Thank you for the assistance in Sichuan. Please accept a bow from me.
I think I speak for many on this blog that we very much would like to have had a chance to lend a hand literally, and are truly appreciative to the people who were there to help.
Please also share your story with us more.
May 26th, 2008 at 1:50 am
CHINA EARTHQUAKE TRIBUTE
A photographic record of nature’s fury, and my deepest heartfelt wish for the Chinese people.
http://atruechineserenaissance.blogspot.com/
May 26th, 2008 at 4:29 am
I am looking on Internet to see how Christian reacts to the disaster, and especially how they think why God lets people suffer. I know many Christians are helping, but the theory about why God let people suffer seems to claim something beyond my understanding. Falun Gong practioners claim it is a Karma on innocent people due to the guilty of party they hate, which is absolutely stupid. As far as I know, Falun Gong organization is not donating or rescuing.
May 26th, 2008 at 8:01 am
Chris Tuey,
“I will remember the trucks full of body bags coming out of the Beichuan school for the rest of my life. Hopefully I will remember FLG not at all.”
Yes, FLG will become falun gone and gone away.
May 26th, 2008 at 8:20 am
Anonymous,
falun gone people not only do not donate one cent but they are trying to brainwash kind people with “compassion” not to help those Sichuan earthquake disaster victims because of their bizzare belief - “the karma retribution of CCP”. However, their brainwash system is not effective and instead backfire badly like they have just created the “bad karma” for the falun gone.
I feel sorry for those people who got brainwashed by the ‘devil in fake buddha suit LHZ and the gang’ to do all the FLG propaganda work to bring suffering to themselves unless they are awaken to their consciousness and repent all those wrong intentions.
May 26th, 2008 at 8:37 am
Jana,
Why LHZ didn’t come out and prevent the disaster from happening like he did with Earth collision? Are you telling me, he told god to attack Sichuan? I believe he said before that he is always talking to other gods not to interfere but this time I guess they cooperate together?
May 26th, 2008 at 12:33 pm
@Jana,
you see people don’t beleive The Epoch Times here. I don’t know what reasons behind them.
I believe the what The Epoch Times says about culture revolution and 1989. my parents had first hand experience with culture revolution and I participated 1989.
But many stories about these days are just untrue(some are true). I don’t know why FLG use the culture revolution style words on every story on The Epoch Times to abuse CCP. The Epoch Times bashes CCP for everything CCP dose and for everything bad happens in China. When there is slave labor, that’s CCP’s fault. When CCP made labor law to protect workers rights and some forien invested factories closed down because of higher labor cost. FLG laughed and blamed CCP again.
I just don’t buy this kind of probganda and lies.spreading hatred dose not serve things well.
I’ve been reading The Epoch Times every week for years but just as entertainment and I’ll be still reading your paper as entertainment.
I would suggest you don’t waste your time and try to convince people here at this stage. You might be marketing in the wrong market.
May 27th, 2008 at 12:13 am
A key issue about the persecution of Falun Gong is whether it is religious persecution, as outsiders have labeled it. It is not. Clearly, the organization is being shut down for its political activities, specifically its anti-government and anti-Party activities. That isn’t any better, but the distinction is worth bearing in mind. In fact, this is the case with many so-called religious rights issues in China. The government can care less about some harmless cult (which Falun Gong is, but there are others), but it does not tolerate well groups that use religion to advance some political agenda, be it overthrowing the government, or separatism.
May 27th, 2008 at 9:27 pm
Jana,
There was a parade by about 2000 Falun goners in Manhattan Chinatown on Sunday. Please tell us how on earth that was “heartfelt wish”.
http://sinovision.net/news.php?act=details&col_id=6&news_id=46435
and about your link,
That was a extremely stupid letter, What ? those protests against Falun goners were organized by Chinese government ? they didnt even have a loud speaker !!
May 28th, 2008 at 1:01 am
Dear Ha Ha,
New York Times printed this story about the crfimes of hatse against Falun Gong in New York by Chinese rent a crowd mobsters.
2 -3 chinese nationlists have been arrested already for crimes of hate and violence agasint Falun Gong. NO FAlun Gong practioners have been arrested and nor will we ever.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/26/nyregion/26falun.html?_r=1&ref=nyregion
&pagewanted=print&oref=slogin
The parade was all about the beauty of Falun Gong. What is wrong about that- NOTHING in any eyes excpet the brainwashed Chinese and Ccp.PLease stop your lies now for a a good future Ha Ha.
May 28th, 2008 at 2:05 am
Dear Jana,
I am asking you a simple question : how on earth is that “heartfelt wish” ?
Now suppose one week after Katrina, Westboro Baptist Church had organized a parade like this, what would Americans people think ?
Here is the tape of the parade, see for yourself.
http://sinovision.net/news.php?act=details&col_id=3&news_id=46364
How on earth did NYTime not inteview those pro-china protestors ?
When Falun goners claimed they cared about victims in the earthquake, an obvious question would be “what Falun organization has done for the victim?” Why didnt reporters ask that question ?
Oh, I seeeeeeeeeee, he knew he couldnt, as Falun has done nothing for the victims in earthquake, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING !!!!
It couldnt be more obvious that the reporter tried to mislead the American people.
You know China had double digit growth in last 10 years, right ? It is very simple to prove NYTimes is unbiased about China :
Just show me an article by New York that said something positively about China. Can you ?
May 28th, 2008 at 2:38 am
How about putting up a pic of their sign and have a real language expert translate it.
I dont know much about FG, but it is distrubing that the Chinese Communists can get a group to come out and attack dissidents.
May 28th, 2008 at 3:09 am
Ha Ha, I dont speak or read Chinese i am english. The link i sent to you re:Chinese earthquake tribute was produced by a Falun Gong practitioner. Did you watch it?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ip656ddj3gI
The propoganda show of the earthquake efforts to make the ccp look good is shocking enough. Those foreign journalists have sold their souls.
The annual parade was to show the Chinese people who have been victums of the brainswashing mind numbing propoganda against Falun Gong that elsewhere in the world in fact in another 80 countries all around the world that Falun Gong is good and no where else in the world is it persecuted.Only in China. Why is that Ha Ha?
The Ccp is not good if it can persecute and commit Genocide on a large amount of good people in China while slandering and spreading their lies about Falun Gong thru out the world.
To take away the fundemental rights of belief from 1.3 billion people is a crime against humanity. One day you will realise what we are doing and why.
We have the greatest wish for all Chinese to be free of the Ccp lies, persecution, corruption,and Genocides.
The Chinese media are known for having no freeom of press but are told what they can write about from the Ccp’s propoganda . And everyone knows that even most of the Chinese people.
Falun Gong Marchers Are Jeered in Chinatown by Chinese mobsters NY Times
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/26/nyregion/26falun.html?_r=1&ref=nyregion&pagewanted=print&oref=slogin
An open letter to the U.S. Secretary of State from the China Support Network; calls for diplomatic demarche to Communist China by John Kusumi
http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did=7492
It’s about the news media by John Kusumi
http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did=7464
NYPD Arrest Three More People for Assaulting Falun Gong Practitioners
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-27/71050.html
Chinese Consul General Admits to Orchestrating Mob in New York
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-24/70954.html
Freeing China from Disaster
Why the Chinese regime needed to stage a riot in Flushing NY
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-20/70842.html
Chinese media toe the survival storyline
http://www.theage.com.au/news/world/chinese-media-toe-the-survival-storyline/2008/05/23/1211183103769.html
Distrust Over Donated Relief Funds VOA
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-22/70909.html
China Red Cross Officials Suspected of Embezzling Donations for Quake Victims
http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-26/71039.html
The Earthquake tribute for Chinese people
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ip656ddj3gI
May 28th, 2008 at 3:34 am
Ha Ha, you ask what Falun Gong have done for Chinese people? They risk their lives everyday for the last 9 years to keep on practising and will not give in to the Ccp for they have no right to ban or commit Genocide of Falun Gong and no right to deceive the Chinese people from their basic human rights . This is what we do for you because it is right!
I ask you what the ccp did for the earthquake victims apart from orchestrate a world wide media campaign to show hoe good they were? They also orchestrated a propoganda campaign against FG to say we do not care and incited their Chinese nationalists overseas to commit hate crimes against Falun Gong.
Heres what you don’t know
The Many Unexplainable “Whys”
While a natural disaster, the earthquake brought calamity because of human errors. These human errors are not technical in nature. They are related to the issue of the CCP’s power. The CCP put concerns for its own power before the requirements for disaster rescue.
Why didn’t the CCP investigate when signs of an earthquake were first reported, but instead jumped at discrediting the information as rumors? The Sichuan government even investigated the “rumor” and publicly “dismissed the rumor” on its official website.
Why did China claim over ten years ago to have an all-weather airdrop force of over 10,000, yet no air drops were performed in the three days after the earthquake?
Why, in the critical 72 hours after the earthquake, did only 20 military jet-planes and less than 1,000 soldiers enter the epicenter in Wenchuan County?
Why did the CCP wait until the fourth day after the earthquake to bring in the world’s largest all-weather jet planes that can carry engineering equipment?
Why at the crucial juncture of the emergency rescue of heaven-bestowed human lives did the CCP refuse the entry of foreign rescue teams?
Why have so many innocent children died or been injured in the collapse of their school buildings, while regime buildings are standing safely?
Why does the Olympics have a budget of over 400 billion Yuan (US$57.4 billion), surpassing the grand total of all previous Olympic games, while the CCP is so careful with money in saving people in disasters?
Why has the CCP issued orders to maintain positive propaganda, instead of reflecting the true suffering of the people in the disaster-hit area?
And don’t say this hasn’t been done before? CCP Staging riots on Falun Gong to deflect the scorn off themselves to others. This is a great opportunity for the world’s people to see first hand how devious the ccp is and how sadly the Chinese living abroad are brainwashed. Of course the ccp would have had to pay them some money to do it but they capitalising on the anger and pain from those they lost in the earthquake.
May 28th, 2008 at 3:44 am
Haha, Jana,
I see how pathetic Falun goners are : they basically dont read anything other than the website and newspaper sponsered by Falun.
To answer one of your question :
Why did China claim over ten years ago to have an all-weather airdrop force of over 10,000, yet no air drops were performed in the three days after the earthquake ?
Two days heavy rain after earthquake, and heavy clouds.
Landslide destoried or blocked all the roads to heavily damaged area.
Keep spouting the BS IN USA, no Chinese give a F@#$ !!!
May 28th, 2008 at 3:48 am
John,
Falun goners has celebrated the earthquake in China for 10 consecutive days.
Every heard of Westboro Baptist Church ? google it.
I am happy that Chinese government kicked Falun out of China. It would be a disaster for China and billions of Chinese if Falun had become a political power in China.
May 28th, 2008 at 4:05 am
To Jana,
I missed your other post,
Anyone who said anything good about chinese government sold their soul to CCP, that is FLG’s logic, am I right ?
That is why NYT didnt have any positive report about China, right ?
Dont even bother to type so much, I live 10 minutes from Flushing, New York. What kind of cold-blood animals would cheer for the earthquake 10 days in a row ? huh ? What kind of religion would make those “chinese” showing no sympathy for those victims in their motherland?
Dont f@#$ing talk to me about brainwashing, I didnt have much opinion about your beloved cult until the earthquake.
Let me tell you, after this incident, Falun is finished among Chinese.
BTW, talking about brainwashing, here is something you would like :
http://www.scribd.com/doc/2575433/I-SEE-DIFFERENT-TIBET-A-FRENCH-HOTEL-TYCOONS-BIKE-TOUR
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/photo/2008-02/15/content_6458228.htm
http://www.westernshugdensociety.org/
May 28th, 2008 at 5:16 am
here’s the taken from clearwisdom.net:
“See hate propaganda for what it is
The CCP lies and slanders Falun Gong, alleging that Falun Gong does not help with disaster relief. They instigate Chinese people to hate Falun Gong, recently employing their henchmen to instigate crowds of hundreds of people to besiege the Flushing Service Center for Quitting the CCP. People were pushing, shoving and violently attacking Falun Gong practitioners. It was strongly reminiscent of the Cultural Revolution in China. Seeing all this, Ms. Li Ailing from Washington DC said, ” I must come to New York to explain to the Chinese there the facts about Falun Gong. Many Falun Gong practitioners were very sad upon learning about the Sichuan earthquake. Falun Gong practitioners use their own ways to provide victims of the earthquake disaster with practical help.”
She explained that, “The CCP takes advantage of a national disaster to once again smear Falun Gong. Many Chinese read newspapers controlled by the CCP. All reports there are against Falun Gong. Actually, the CCP is the source of disaster for Chinese people. The CCP did not report earthquake forecasts, nor did it warn citizens so that there would have been fewer casualties. Many school buildings collapsed, but few government departments’ buildings collapsed in the earthquake. The CCP was reluctant to allow international relief support to enter. The CCP takes people for granted, and delayed efforts to save people. All of this can be seen by those willing to accept the truth. To save China, people must quit the evil CCP. ”
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
These are the reasons falun gone are pathetic.
“The CCP lies and slanders Falun Gong, alleging that Falun Gong does not help with disaster relief. They instigate Chinese people to hate Falun Gong, recently employing their henchmen to instigate crowds of hundreds of people to besiege the Flushing Service Center for Quitting the CCP.”
Chinese people hate falun gone not because of of CCP but their outpouring compassion towards Chinese in homeland and it has nothing to do with CCP’s instigation as alleged by the falun gone propaganda. As always, anyone oppose to falun gone must be sided with CCP, their extreme logic theory.
“It was strongly reminiscent of the Cultural Revolution in China.”
This is U.S.A. wake up. Anyone can assemble to counter protest peacefully but as you can see in news video, falun goners invoke the violence because their people were using cameras approaching towards and sticking up to the earthquake sympathetic protesters. They know they can create sensational news to provoke angers so they can claim “see I told you so”.
Ms. Li Ailing from Washington DC said, “Falun Gong practitioners use their own ways to provide victims of the earthquake disaster with practical help.”
Hmmm. what is their practical help?
Then she said, “Many Chinese read newspapers controlled by the CCP. All reports there are against Falun Gong. Actually, the CCP is the source of disaster for Chinese people. The CCP did not report earthquake forecasts, nor did it warn citizens so that there would have been fewer casualties. Many school buildings collapsed, but few government departments’ buildings collapsed in the earthquake. The CCP was reluctant to allow international relief support to enter. The CCP takes people for granted, and delayed efforts to save people. All of this can be seen by those willing to accept the truth. To save China, people must quit the evil CCP. ”
The only newspaper and TV news that are not CCP influence is “epochtimes” and “NTD TV” because it’s under CIA influence.
Like U.S. can forecast earthquake for 1994 Nortridge earthquake or look at what has the prediction like “California Has More Than 99% Chance Of A Big Earthquake WIthin 30 Years, Report Shows”. (source: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/04/080414203459.htm)
Show me the pictures of government building in the epicenter and I will believe you.
China allowed rescue workers and aids from Japan,Singapore,Russia,U.S. - where has she been? I think China should allow Li Hongzhi and all falun gones to return to China as rescue workers. Will they return is the question.
You can never win when you argue with falun goners because their ego is so hugh and they couldn’t hear a word, their heart is so cold and their eyes are spinning with falun at a dizzing spell and can’t see any truth except evil Li and the gang’s order.
May 28th, 2008 at 1:45 pm
The Chinese Consul General for New York City, Mr. Peng Keyu, was recorded by an investigator for the World Organization to Investigate the Persecution of Falun Gong as he admitted that he had “encouraged” the mobs in Flushing.
You can visit this website for further details: http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-24/70954.html
The Consul General says, “I have always gone to them and thanked them in person.” He continues, “I ran other things on the scene.”
The Consul General admits in that conversation that he is playing on the passions generated among the Chinese people by the Sichuan earthquake.
The Chinese-language media controlled by the Chinese regime have thrown a match on these combustible feelings by reporting that Falun Gong practitioners in Flushing have interfered with the collection of earthquake relief and are against China—although those media reports do not have a single piece of evidence to back up their claims.
Source: http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-28/71101.html
As for the CCP’s claims of, “Falun Gong adherents are happy about the Sichuan earthquake,” Mike Hu, who is working in Flushing pointed out, “Such sayings probably come from someone with an axe to grind.”
Hu continued, “I did not see that Falun Gong adherents were against providing disaster relief or gloating over China’s disaster. It is an error in logic to talk about the two topics together. Many people are wrong that Falun Gong practitioners were happy about the earthquake, disagreed with sending relief to the disaster area and hoped that China would have bad luck.”
“Please take a careful look at their banners—’The Gods bless the Chinese nation.’ The Chinese nation includes all Chinese people. So everyone should take a look or they will be fooled again. It is sad for us, the common people, to be fighting each other again as if it was the Cultural Revolution. Our Chinese nation has gone through too many disasters. I hope everyone will finally live a happy life.”
Source: http://en.epochtimes.com/news/8-5-27/71050.html
May 28th, 2008 at 4:05 pm
Jan,
I’ve gone to the above link and listened to the recording, and I encourage others to do the same. You can compare it to the English translation.
And the result is precisely why so many Chinese have become increasingly disgusted with the Falun Gong. The article is a clear twist on the consul-general’s words.
The consul-general, in the spirit of full disclosure (apparently thinking the caller is someone he can trust?), admits that he gives “signals” to the overseas Chinese organizations about key issues. But even with a trusted caller, he doesn’t say anything about “organizing” the protests. He only says he personally thanked the overseas Chinese groups who’ve led the protests, and that he believes one of his important responsibilities is making sure overseas Chinese groups feel a part of the Chinese community.
All of this boils down to the Chinese community having had enough of the Falun Gong’s message. Saying “God Destroys the Chinese Communists” in the aftermath of an earthquake that killed 80,000 people has successfully unleashed the fury of a whole community that’s usually very passive.
May 28th, 2008 at 9:59 pm
source: http://www.anti-cnn.com/forum/en/thread-1904-1-1.html
what i learn on the western media
A devastating disaster came!
We won’t be defeated.
The western media remains silence when they withnessed our government’s quick action and perfect relief aid!
While some of them still misunderstood China and its government.They accused that it was unfair that China turned
down their request of coming to China to do some commentary report.
When I heard this news,I was quite striking.I know that you western people consider life as everything.How can you
commented that China had done wrong.
As we all know,every minute counts,even in rescuing time.I don’t know why can you come up with such a foolish question.
You said that you have the rights to report the truth. But you don’t have the rights to add burdens to the government there.
Chinese government now focus on rescuing people who are still suffering.They have no time for your visit and have no extra
hand to protect you.
Please think of others before thinking of yourself.If you can’t,you can’t be a real journalist or reporter,cause your purpose
is very simple,which is money or others.
All in all, I am not going to against the western media.It’s their fault,not mine.I needn’t to be angry about those lies.It’s no use.
What I going to do is to protect and construct my country.And we’ll be stronger and stronger.
At last,welcome to Beijing!
May 28th, 2008 at 10:05 pm
Crying Nurse Guides Rescue Team
http://www.anti-cnn.com/forum/en/thread-1917-1-1.h
May 28th, 2008 at 10:30 pm
Source: http://www.gmw.cn/01gmrb/2008-05/17/content_775470.htm
“I won’t have you saying that!”
“I won’t have you saying that!” (Liu Jun, Guangming Correspondent, Geneva, 2008-05-17 07:37, source: GuangMing Daily) 【Translation】ltbriar “I won’t have you saying that!” Marie Heuzé, the Director of the United Nations Information Service in Geneva, today rebutted certain Western reporter criticism on China’s quake relief based on the so-called “Freedom of the Press”. The attack by severe earthquake in Wenchuan area of China receives strong concerns from the World. Swift and effective relief efforts by the Chinese Government also gained international approval and a lot of media applauded “China impressed the World”. Yet in midst of Chinese people’s heavily involved in their relief work, certain Western reporter tied the so-called “Freedom of the Press” with China’s relief work over a regular Press Briefing in UN’s Office at Geneva,Europe, but was strongly countered by the spokesperson of UN, as well as spokespersons of various UN organizations, who all highly rated China’s relief efforts. In this morning’s News Briefing, various UN organizations gave briefing over Chinese progress in its relief, and details on the joint relief efforts by UN and China. Just when the Briefing was about to end, a Western reporter claimed that Chinese Government’s prohibiting Western media from entering the quake zone for news coverage was a violation of “the Freedom of the Press”. His comment was strongly rebutted. Marie Heuzé, the Director of the United Nations Information Service, not her usual self of being calm and nice, instantly gave a strong response, “I won’t have you saying that!” Then she explained in detail the cooperation of UN with China after Wenchuan’s quake. She emphasized that rescue effort is to save lives, an humanity emergency which should never be tied to other unrelated issues. Elizabeth Byrs, spokesperson for the Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs in her reddened eyes and shaken voice, commented that the rescue was a race with time; the quicker the relief team reached ground zero, the more chance of saving one more life. The prime most important mission for the first few days after the quake was to rescue lives under the debris. Chinese relief teams faced severe conditions of road blockages which disabled moving heavy equipments on site. The fact that they rushed to the sites on foot and rescued with bare hands by itself was remarkable. She stressed that the cooperation between the Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs and China had been very smooth since the quake. The principle of rescue relief is to guarantee the swift mobilization of China’s own relief forces on site for emergency rescue, and China did not deny International relief efforts. Other UN spokespersons also expressed that media should be objective and fair, and should not relate humanity relief with other issues, that they will try their best in assisting Chinain its relief and rebuilding. Listening to all these voices, from the press area I raised my hand to request to speak. My request was granted and I tried to hold back my emotion to speak calmly to about a hundred reporters on the scene,”I have to give this uninformed inquirer a lesson of “Geography and Ethics”! China is much bigger than Europe, and the quake occurred in remote mountain areas in S.W. China. With the severe damage made by the quake, and on top of the bad weather, even Chinese relief teams were unable to be right on spot in the epic centre area. How will it be possible under such poor transport and communications conditions, that we, at the expense of saving valuable lives, allow foreign reporters unfamiliar with local condition and languages to be there first? Western media uses to claim they “cherish Life on top of everything”, don’t they? Just how could you intervene our life-saving efforts by the so-called “Freedom of the Press”?! There was a complete silence. (May 16, 2008 Guang Ming Daily, from Geneva)
「我不許你這麼說！」本報駐日內瓦記者 劉軍 發佈時間：2008-05-17 07:37 來源：光明日報「我不許你這麼說!」——聯合國新聞發言人瑪麗·厄澤女士今天嚴詞駁斥了某西方記者以所謂「新聞自由」抨擊中國抗震救災的言論。中國汶川地區遭受特大地震災害後,受到全世界的強烈關注。中國政府迅速有力的救災行動也得到了全世界的認可和讚揚,不少媒體稱讚「中國令世界感動」。然而就在中國人民頑強抗震救災的危急關頭,極個別西方記者今天卻在日內瓦聯合國歐洲辦事處舉行的新聞發佈會上,將中國的抗震救災與所謂的「新聞自由」強行聯繫在一起,遭到高度評價中國救災工作的聯合國新聞發言人、聯合國各組織發言人的嚴詞反駁。在今天上午的新聞發佈會上,聯合國各組織首先介紹了中國抗震救災的進展情況和聯合國與中國在抗震救災過程中團結協作的詳情。就在新聞發佈會即將結束之際, 一名西方媒體記者提問稱,中國政府不許西方記者進入災區報導,有悖「新聞自由」。此言一出,當即引起強烈的反應。聯合國新聞發言人厄澤女士一反慣常的沉穩溫和態度,嚴厲地搶先回應道:「我不許你這麼說!」隨後,她詳細地解釋了汶川發生地震災害後聯合國與中國的合作情況。她強調,抗震救災是搶救生命,是人道主義緊急救援行動,絕不能與其他不相干的事情聯繫在一起。聯合國人道主義救援署發言人伊莎貝拉·比爾斯女士紅了眼圈,她聲音顫抖地說,抗震救災是在與時間賽跑,救援人員早進入災區一秒鍾,就能多救出一條生命。災情發生後的前幾天最重要的任務是搶救被埋在廢墟下的生命。中國救援人員是在道路交通嚴重堵塞,重型機械無法進入救援現場的情況下,徒步前進,用雙手搶救受災群眾,可歌可泣。她強調,聯合國人道主義救援署與中國的合作從地震發生伊始就非常順暢,救災的原則是首先保證讓中國自己的救援人員迅速進入災區開展緊急搶救,中國也並沒有拒絕國際援助。其他聯合國組織發言人也紛紛表示,媒體應該客觀公正,不能將人道主義救援與其他問題牽扯在一起,表示將盡一切努力幫助中國抗震救災,重建家園。聽到這些公正的聲音,坐在台下記者席中的我也再按捺不住,立刻舉手要求發言。得到發言許可後,面對現場百餘名記者,我強忍心中的激動,努力維持平穩的語速:「我要給這位無知提問者上一堂『地理和道德課』!中國的面積比歐洲還大,而且地震災區位於中國西南部的偏遠山區。地震造成的破壞巨大,加之氣候條件惡劣,即便是中國救援人員都很難在第一時間進入災區中心地帶。怎麼能在交通通訊資源已經非常匱乏的情況下,置危在旦夕的生命於不顧,而讓不瞭解當地環境和語言的外國記者首先進入?西方媒體不是一向標榜『最珍惜生命』的嗎,怎麼能以所謂的『新聞自由』來干擾我們搶救生命的努力?!」全場靜默。（本報日內瓦5月 16日電） http://www.anti-cnn.com/forum/cn/thread-54664-1-1.html [ Last edited by TRuth-home at 19-5-2008 17:14 ]
May 29th, 2008 at 1:45 am
I am deeply sorry that you cannot see the truth of Falun Gong and that you insist on supporting a brutal communist regime who murders and tortures anyone who puts a higher power ahead of it.
I won’t be speaking any further on these matters on this blog as it appears to fall on deaf and already poisoned hearts and minds. This is what I am most sad about for you.
I will hope and pray for the Chinese people to come thru this great tradgedy that has befallen them now.
Take care and please in you hearts remember “Falun Dafa Hao”!
May 29th, 2008 at 3:13 am
specul8r,
Are you a regular visitor on Anti-CNN? I don’t have time to visit, but I would be happy to translate anything on your site that you think the Western audience might be interested in seeing.
http://blog.foolsmountain.com/?p=121
http://blog.foolsmountain.com/?page_id=2
May 30th, 2008 at 12:59 am
Your comments that Falun Gong members were showing their ‘ugly side’ are complete garbage. I had friends that went to the Falun Gong meeting and commented on how amazingly peaceful those people were. But considering the brutal methods the CCP used to suppress Falun Gong, I am not at all suprised that they are still quite angry. How would you feel if you had family members tortured and murdered for absolutely no good reason what so ever?
Furthermore, any members of Chinese diasporas, or members of diasporas of any national origin for that matter, that attempt to infringe upon the free-speech or freedom of religion of US citizens via intimidation should be deported from this country PERMANENTLY. To use CCP style rhetoric, “Such acts hurt the feelings of the American people and are an affront to American values and principles.” BTW, I am not anti-Chinese, but I will not condone barbaric tactics of Chinese citizens in my own country. As I see more and more of such shameful acts being perpetrated by Chinese citizens, I lose more and more respect for them.
May 30th, 2008 at 1:32 am
Jannifer,
And what are those “barbaric tactics of Chinese citizens”? Please provide some examples with evidence.
May 30th, 2008 at 2:07 am
Jana,
I am sorry that you feel disappointed. Please be assured this blog is not meant for only those who think alike. If so, what would be the point?
I would also like to respectfully suggest that your accusation of “poisoned hearts and minds” is misplaced. As far as I can tell, a majority of the people participating on this site engage in discussions and debates in good faith.
As for your defense of FLG in the context of this blog post “fall[ing] on deaf”, I would like to point to your own blog site and the entry titled “China’s earthquake tribute”, which contains the following:
I think I speak for most of the readers that we do not agree with your position. When tragedy of this kind hit, the most important thing on our mind is definitely not what the CCP do or what to do about the CCP.
And by the way, I am not pro-CCP. I am just pro-China.
May 30th, 2008 at 4:42 am
http://uk.youtube.com/profile?user=NTDTV
May 30th, 2008 at 5:13 am
Buxi,
I am not that regular visit that site but I told my western friends about the western media bias regarding China. I am not from China but I am Chinese American now and when people sell their country to lie about our motherland, I am angry and will expose all those scums to show who is telling the truth.
May 30th, 2008 at 5:26 am
Take a look:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zb8v4j6nLko
May 30th, 2008 at 5:28 am
RE: Barbaric tactics…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zb8v4j6nLko
May 30th, 2008 at 5:48 am
Jennifer,
“I had friends that went to the Falun Gong meeting and commented on how amazingly peaceful those people were. But considering the brutal methods the CCP used to suppress Falun Gong, I am not at all suprised that they are still quite angry.”
You are contradicting yourself; peaceful people will not get angry; enlightened people will not get angry because they know what is enlightened means and people who don’t usually think they are enlightened but they are not. If you want to know more on spiritual words, go and read J. Krishnamurti and you will understand what I am talking about.
“Furthermore, any members of Chinese diasporas, or members of diasporas of any national origin for that matter, that attempt to infringe upon the free-speech or freedom of religion of US citizens via intimidation should be deported from this country PERMANENTLY.”
To instill fear will have no affects on people who has done everything according to the law. We didn’t burn cross and we didn’t spray swastika on the walls of synagogue or things like that nature. How are we intimidating, madam? We are expressing our disgust of why falun gone members are not doing as normal human beings should to help the suffering fellow chinese people in their homeland; instead, they were celebrating days after days of “heaven destroy china”. Even if they don’t have donation drive, that’s understandable but why celebrating “heaven destroy china” during this emotional period? It’s very insensitive part of their culture that invoke regular Chinese to get angry at them.
“To use CCP style rhetoric, “Such acts hurt the feelings of the American people and are an affront to American values and principles.” BTW, I am not anti-Chinese, but I will not condone barbaric tactics of Chinese citizens in my own country. As I see more and more of such shameful acts being perpetrated by Chinese citizens, I lose more and more respect for them.”
Let me ask you this, have you been to China and see things with your own eyes or you just hear hearsay from certain people? Many Americans and Canadians have completely change their stance against China after they actually visited China and Tibet, and started to realize their countries were feeding them biased news and recent FLG media is one of the source of negative biased news. For your information, I am not Chinese citizens.
May 30th, 2008 at 6:33 am
“I am not Chinese citizens.”
OK. Try, “I am not a Chinese citizen.” Judging from your lack of command of English, you aren’t a US citizen either. Anyways, I’ve known people who have visited or lived in China who came back with a less than favorable impression of it. Anyways, RE: barbaric tactics, here you go: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zb8v4j6nLko
May 30th, 2008 at 6:53 am
Jennifer,
You have said “I had friends that went to the Falun Gong meeting and commented on how amazingly peaceful those people were.” This seems to mean that you are positioning to make the comment as a neutral third party observer. But your posting of the video from the mouth piece of Falun Gong leads me to suspect that you are actually a follower of Falun Gong. So please help us understand where you are coming from. Are you a Falun Gong follower or not?
May 30th, 2008 at 7:01 am
Jen,
There is no need to mock someone’s imperfection in mastering the English. And I fail to see how this helps you make a point in this thread of discussion/debate.
And are you the same person as Jennifer?
May 30th, 2008 at 5:23 pm
My point is that “specul8r” is lying about not being a Chinese citizen. I have taught English to Chinese speakers before and I know exactly what kind of grammar errors they make. And if “specul8r” is not a Chinese citizen, why does he/she refer to a collective “we” when trying to defend the Chinese mob in Flushing? This blog is clearly a joke.
May 30th, 2008 at 5:36 pm
Jen,
Really? Grammar mistakes are related to citizenship and political status? Well, I am a Chinese citizen, and proud of it. Am I making the kind of grammar errors that “we” make?
There must be a joke here, but I’m not sure it’s the blog that’s responsible.
On this blog, we’re trying to get past emphasis on grammar (and even citizenship status). Think you can try responding to specul8r’s numerous other points?
May 30th, 2008 at 7:10 pm
Jen is liar, she is a Falun goner.
Only a Falun goner would call the chinese protestors in Flushing, NY “mob”.
May 31st, 2008 at 12:45 am
to Jen,
“OK. Try, “I am not a Chinese citizen.” Judging from your lack of command of English, you aren’t a US citizen either. Anyways, I’ve known people who have visited or lived in China who came back with a less than favorable impression of it.”
What make you so sure that I am a Chinese citizen?
Just because I am against falun gone? You are dead wrong over and over. I am not against those people who practice spiritual way of living but I am against those leaders who teach flase spiritual ways with instilling fear on their followers, using borrowed terms from Buddhism without fully understand what the terminology means, and besides… their hidden propaganda of political movements. I don’t get involve in politics and I can care more or less of what Communist do or do not. but I am in favor of speaking the truths and I find truths not from one sided reports like you all have from epochtimes or NTDTV.
Since I was so critical of those falun gone leaders and you are so defensive for falun gone, you must be one of the leaders of those falun gone. “You have known people visited …” but you are not the ‘first person experience’ of the truth. If you can take other people’s truth because they look so kind and naive, you should be worried about yourself. Buddha Sakyamuni said to his disciples, “Don’t take all of my words as truth because I am so and so, you have to test them, contemplate them and experience them. If you don’t experience the same as I said, then those are not the truths to you.” Can you or falun gone practioners do that?
I know exactly why you suspect of me a Chinese Citizen. You have read those (bad) english translation I posted. I didn’t change a thing and I posted the way it was in the anti-cnn.com forum.
May you be enlightened someday.
May 31st, 2008 at 12:53 am
To Jen,
“My point is that “specul8r” is lying about not being a Chinese citizen. I have taught English to Chinese speakers before and I know exactly what kind of grammar errors they make. And if “specul8r” is not a Chinese citizen, why does he/she refer to a collective “we” when trying to defend the Chinese mob in Flushing? This blog is clearly a joke.”
I can meet with you face to face and proof to you 100% that I am not a Chinese citizen. If you are wrong, will you apologize to the moderator of this blog? I dare you to take this challenge.
For your information, I am in California and nowhere near to be at Flushing, N.Y. I was expressing as “we” on this blog and not representing in Flushing, N.Y. haha.
May you be enlightened someday.
May 31st, 2008 at 1:04 am
Buxi,
Jennifer wants to get at me because she cannot defend those points on this blog and the only way to discredit me is to smear me as “Chinese Citizen”, just like “falun goner” do and no doubt about that she is one like them. I don’t mix politics with spiritual living nor sports. Let the politicians do their own politics.
June 1st, 2008 at 1:05 am
why “falun gone is a cult”
Here’s the proof why falun gone is “self promoting cult” by watching these falun gone propaganda websites and sites that refute the images are hoax
Falun Gone propaganda websites:
1) Images (google search - udumbara flower + falun gong)
http://images.google.com/images?q=udumbara%20flower%20falun%20gong&sourceid=navclient-ff&ie=UTF-8&rls=DVFA,DVFA:1970–2,DVFA:en&um=1&sa=N&tab=wi
2) udumbara flower found in Australia (clearwisdom.net)
http://www.clearwisdom.net/emh/articles/2007/9/2/89172.html
3) udumbara flower found in California (clearwisdom.net)
http://www.clearwisdom.net/emh/articles/2007/8/18/88700.html
4) udumbara video broadcast from NTDTV to promote another Buddha (meaning LHZ) returning to save mankind
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7mycKWApIc
___________________________________
ARE YOU READY? COMPARE IMAGES FROM LACEWING EGG WITH UDUMBARA FLOWER (as falun gone sites claimed) AND SEE FOR YOURSELF. READ 2 FOR EXPLANATION.
1) IMAGES OF LACEWING EGG (GOOGLE SEARCH)
http://images.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=lacewing+egg&spell=1
2) FLOWERS GROWING ON STEEL? I BEG TO DIFFER…
http://urbanlegends.about.com/b/2007/06/20/flowers-grow-on-steel-pipe-in-china.htm
___________________________________
Do you see now why falun gone has been telling the truth? They lied and cheated their members to make LHZ appears larger than life, a new BUDDHA returning to the world to save mankind. Yeah… right.
June 1st, 2008 at 3:45 am
Today, (Sunday) Falun goners gathered again in Flushing, New York, around noon time, talking about how CCP caused the earthquake.
June 1st, 2008 at 6:20 am
As Chinese American, all I want to see is CCP to stop the persecution of innocent people, that’s all. We all know the communist offers no human rights in China and that’s a fact! I support FLG simply they are the only group dare to stand up to the communist. Obviously, there are some pro communist Chinese people here in the states and you know what, they are not welcomed here.
June 2nd, 2008 at 2:49 am
Lee,
As you support FLG, your opinion means nothing to Chinese. More or less, we dont consider you as one of Chinese and you are not welcome in China.
June 2nd, 2008 at 4:08 am
w,
i think otherwise. Perhaps communist won’t welcome people like me, but just like FLG said, Communist ruled China not equal to China.
Is the word “we” in your comment represent the ordinary Chinese people, or communist party, or other group or individual? Please specify. As far as I know, there are still people practice FLG in China silently, do you consider these people Chinese?
BTW, you sound very much like a communist by threaten and against anyone who think different, but you know what, this is America and I can support who ever I want.
June 2nd, 2008 at 5:43 am
Lee,
A cult is a cult no matter how it is practicing silently or not. Will you support David Koresh and Branch Davidian of Waco Texas if they were practicing silently? Will you support Jim Jones, Heaven’s Gate by knowingly they are cult and mind their own business?
It has been repeatedly shown that falun gone group is not practicing of their “truthfulness-compassion-forbearance” at all; they cheat and lie, they have no compassion to humanity and their compassion is narrowly defined to falun goners only, and they don’t have any forbearance quality at all. The leaders has been cheating practioners who were originally innocent people and turn them into anti-China for their political purpose and use them as scapegoat to die for their cult leader.
June 2nd, 2008 at 3:15 pm
from my observance, flg has no history of your claim out side of China. Only the communist china started called them cult in their propagandas, and you know what, I never trust them nor their controlled media.
The communist made a mistake by started everything and it just got too brutal, now will cause them a lot of trouble to get it resolved because unlike any other group/individual, it seems flg is the toughest and isn’t going away anytime soon. The communist party has many issues on its hand inside China, corruption, Olympic, earthquake, pollutions, etc, and they got the flg and tibet pressure from outside of China. FLG is the toughest “challenger” communist faced so far. If flg is really a cult, communist would have got rid of them long time ago, but til today, flg still exists in China, and how is it possible they can diminish flg outside of China?
People can tell me flg is bad this and bad that, but they seem very peaceful and never caused much trouble.
June 2nd, 2008 at 5:29 pm
Lee,
I met dozns of new oversea chinese students in last 5 years, I went back to China and met hundreds of China, none of them talk any negative things about this governemnt.
When I asked them what they think of the dissidents in USA, the answers were “let them mess up with themselves.” or ” what on earth do they want from China ? another India or another Russia ? ”
Enjoy your rampage, we dont give a damn. As you call me a CCP member, you are damn wrong, I participated in 1986 and 1989 democracy demonstration. I dont care communism or capitalism, one party system or two party sysme, it is a good government if majority of its people support it.
BTW, I have seen the west democracy, China would be in complete chaos with west democracy. Maybe that is what you like to see, sorry we wont listen to you.
June 2nd, 2008 at 5:40 pm
I think FLG is more like a religion than a cult, but I don’t know how to properly distinguish between “cult” and “religion” in English. FLG is certainly not similar to other traditional “Chinese” religions; it’s very secular, and it paints unbelievers as potentially being evil and dangerous. As I’ve discussed before, traditionally, religions (Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism, ancestor-worship) were treated more as schools of thought.
Most Chinese borrowed teachings from these religions as necessary; if you were to look closely, I think it’s probable that even the Chinese who’ve converted to Christianity still burn incense at a Buddhist temple now and then.
The FLG has been very successful in terms of maintaining a presence on the mainland, that’s certain. Despite tight government censorship, truth is many (most?) Chinese have been “exposed” to FLG writings. This is done through random telephone calls, fliers stuffed into mailboxes, random emails, chatting online via QQ or MSN. I personally know many have read the infamous 9 Commentaries, for example.
But my personal observations tell me that FLG claims that it is building any influence in China today, taht it is a “challenger”… that’s a complete myth. All of this exposure hasn’t increased any sort of public sympathy for FLG in China.
The FLG’s ridiculous claims which make it suspicious in the West (30 million resigned from the Communist Party?), also make it suspicious in mainland China. The one-sided, one-minded political agenda in its writings have inoculated many Chinese against what they have to say. Most netizens are just annoyed at being repeatedly spammed, and mock the messages they receive.
June 2nd, 2008 at 6:56 pm
w,
I traveled all over China twice on train for 2 months twice and both was a good experience. The “happy Chinese” are those got richer over the past years but that’s still a very limited number. A lot Chinese are still poor, many are unhappy about the conditions and unfair treatment. Yes, I agree on the economic side of china has improved and many people got richer. However, there are so many problems exists that fundamentally impossible to resolve. For example, no check and balance, top to down corruptions, and deteriorate moral standard, etc, and if you ask me, communist government is the origin of these problems. Some people said to allow some time to change, I am very optimistic on that suggestion. If democracy works in Taiwan, why it won’t work in China? Back to the subject on flg, regardless their political intention or not, it’s only good for all the Chinese people that the flg’s pressure putting on the communist government for the better.
Out of curiosity, why did you participate 6/4, and why you’ve changed your views now?
June 2nd, 2008 at 9:08 pm
Lee,
That is right, there are still tons of problem in China, that doesnt mean democracy wouldve solved the problem, actually there would be lot more problems in China with west democracy. Actually, West democracy is basically “mememe” philosophy, and never work well in a poor or developing country. and it has allowed all kinds of garbage flooding into every corner of the society.
Let me use an example to illustrate the situation in China :
Suppose you have to take 20 children to lunch, one of the children wants McDonald, one wants pizza, one wants chinese foods, one wants donkin donuts, etc.
What will you do ?
No matter where you take them to, there will be some kids who are unhappy with the food YOU CHOOSE FOR HIM.
So the best you can do is to make most of them happy; if 18 or 19 of 20 children liked the foods, you did an excellent job, THOUGH ONE OR TWO CHILDREN ARE UNHAPPY.
Now imagine you have to live with 20 children for 4 weeks, sometimes, sometimes you will yell “shut up.”
That is the problem of human right in China West has been talking about in last 10 years.
June 2nd, 2008 at 9:09 pm
Here is the so-called west democracy :
Russell A. Castro Department of Sociology & Criminal Justice Southeastern Louisiana University, proposed the Elite Model for Americal politics in which he states:
The elite model argues that power within society is highly concentrated. The elite model posits THREE levels of power in American society:
1) the power-elite (extremely powerful) 2) the government (powerful) 3) the mass public (relatively powerless).
Less than 1% of the U.S population own approximately 85% of the nations “income-producing-wealth.”
(Diana Kendall 1999, Sociology in Our Times)
The top 400 households in the United States earned over 1% of the total income paid out to the ENTIRE U.S national population of 280 MILLION people.(New York Times 2003)
The tiny “Power-Elite” class control: Energy (Oil, Natural Gas, and other energy technologies). Banking & Investment Securities. Insurance (life/health, property, & commercial). Transportation (Automobile, Aircraft, and Sea Vessel production & sales + the air-travel and transport businesses). Pharmaceuticals. Commercial Food Production. The Mass Media (TV, Radio, & Entertainment).
THE ELITE MODEL: Summarized In this way, candidates selected (through economic support) by the elite compete in elections arranged and driven by organizations supported by the elite (political parties) and are voted into office (and thus, made legitimate) by the mass-public, who get all of their information about the social world (and about politics) from the mass media, which is dominated and controlled by the elite.
June 2nd, 2008 at 9:15 pm
About corruption, it is universal problem, Russia had widespread problem of corruption under Yeltin.
the same in US, Bernard Kerik
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernard_Kerik
……..
A week later, Kerik withdrew his nomination, explaining that he had employed an illegal immigrant as a nanny; subsequently, numerous allegations surfaced which would likely have led to a confirmation battle. In 2006, Kerik pled guilty to two unrelated ethics violations after an investigation by the Bronx District Attorney’s Office, and was ordered to pay $221,000. He is currently under Federal investigation: A grand jury issued a multi-count indictment on November 8, 2007 alleging conspiracy, mail fraud, wire fraud and lying to the IRS. Kerik surrendered to authorities on Friday, November 9, 2007, was arraigned before Magistrate Judge George Yanthis in White Plains, New York Federal Court, and pled not guilty to all 16 charges
BTW, for those who dont know who Bernard Kerik is :
he was the chief of NYPD during 911, a hero at that time
____________________________
Of course, as you hate chinese government, you will blame anything bad in China on the government.
June 2nd, 2008 at 9:30 pm
To your question :
Out of curiosity, why did you participate 6/4, and why you’ve changed your views now?
My answer :
We didnt try to overthrow the government, we wanted west democracy and believed that China would be much much better with west democracy. (for example, see the way they handle after Katrina, government doesnt care.)
Then I came to Ameria, I found out the West system is basically a system for rich, totally different from what I believed. and More, West system caused tons of social problems in society : drug, mafia, unions (they fighted for every dollars even in recession, as result, lot of city bankrupts), paying lot more than necessary for medication.
What is worse, people know the problems, but the system wont be able to solve them.
I am not saying chinese government is perfect, it will get better gradually, a change like in Russia would be a disaster for China and chinese people.
June 2nd, 2008 at 9:42 pm
w,
First of all, in your example, to treat Chinese people as “children” is not appropriate and disrespectful. Second, Chinese people were never able or offered to choose “pizza” or “McDonald”.
Like I said earlier, Taiwan already proves that democracy can work for the Chinese, it already paved a way and set example to illustrate how the nationalist gave up its power and adopted democracy. But of course, the Nationalist is not at the same level as Communist.
American government is not perfect but that’s another topic and if you want to discuss, we can focus on that later on.
June 2nd, 2008 at 11:23 pm
Lee,
I actually see the Taiwan model to be a big
failuredisappointment, so far. It’s a miracle that Taiwan wasn’t torn apart in the last eight years. (Hmm, I should qualify my claim; I mean physically. Psychologically, …)If you think the last seven and half years are bad in the US, Taiwan serves as a reminder that it could have gotten much much worse. Yes, they elected Ma now and it is interesting to see how things would be turned around in the next 4 or 8 years. I wish the best for Taiwan as it struggling to get out of its prolonged nightmare.
Call my perspective a glass half empty one, but I simply see Taiwan serving as a bad example of how disruptive and destructive it could be for a system to transit to the democracy in a sudden manner. And don’t forget that the overall condition in Taiwan was far more favorable for such a transition than it is currently in the mainland.
June 3rd, 2008 at 12:45 am
Lee,
The job of a government is making its people living better and happier.
How does it accomplish that ? Listen to its people (children in my analog), see what they need and design the best plan and carry it out.
Did west system accomplish that ? No. The following are some examples and explanation :
________________________________
WEST SYSTEM IS BUILT ON WEALTH, the reason you feel so perfect about this system is that you are allowed to make $10,000 more after 3 years while those richest make 10 million dollar more. That is why US system worked so perfectly after WWII till 1970s.
For example, the current oil price, one effective way is that Government put pressure on those oil companies giving away some of their profits. Did you ever hear your media talking about ” the pocket of oil companies is getting fatter and fatter.” ? Bush will never do that, Obama wont be able to do that even he wants to.
NRA, the national rifle organization, why cant congress pass a simple and reasonable law of background check ? and Read your media, it is like either complete ban of gun sale or no control at all, like there is nothing in between. Why didnt your media set up a column talking about effective law that keep guns from criminals ?
Even in economy recession, no money is spared on military,(you know that one less SR-71 plane wouldve saved a big city for a year.) NEVER !!! WHY? Lockheed Martin corp wouldnt allow that !!! Did you ever see your media talking about cutting military spending ?
In 1998, when government had surplus for the first time in 20+ years, Greenspan suggested to pay back some debts with surplus, which is the idea of Reaganism. What happened ? Nothing !!! You know why ? cuz Wall street didnt like it, they wanted to use those money to booming the economy so they could keep making millions and millions of dollars.
Now about New Orlean, since after the first 1 month of Katrina, how often do you hear media talking about rebuilding Katrina or the current situation in New Orlean? what happened to those people who lost their house ? How were those schools that were under water during Katrina ? Why was there no reports? Why not government order one less SR-71 plane ? 100 million dollars wouldve done tons of help to the poor people in New Orlean.
____________________________
Before you criticize chinese government, you should know two concepts :
1) the difference between criticizing the government and bashing the government.
2) The differnece between “you can vote.” and ” your vote count.”
and also you should explain why China would be better with the idea system in your mind. Taiwan was one party system all the time until about 1990, the democracy didnt do much for Taiwan. Chinese certainly dont want to become another India.
Actually, Chinese government listen to its people lot more than West unless someone try to bash the system, which is not allowed in West either, remember McCathyism ?
June 3rd, 2008 at 2:34 am
Good info, it makes me realize the good part being here in the states is we are able to gather more information than in China and thus allowing people to think independently. Let’s face it, none of us could openly discuss this flg issues in china’s website without getting into trouble from the police. Is it good or bad?
To keep matter simple and focus on the topic on the discussion, and after read over almost every reply on this blog, I think people here forgot what the fundamental cause of our disagreements. Many here don’t agree with flg and related activity but few ask why they are doing it. Instead arguing round and round, situation would be better here if we can dig to the root of the problem of argument. From my record and to trace back, it was the communist started to defame and persecution of flg, and that leads to all the headaches and public relations nightmare they are facing now. If communist weren’t being so harsh and maybe used other more peaceful methods, I think we wouldn’t see so many flg handing out flyers and newspapers, thus we wouldn’t be here arguing our hearts out. Personally, I think the communist have overdone it and it was a mistake.
Now if we look at the whole picture:
At one corner in the ring, we got the Communist party, they are well equipped, they got guns, they got army, they got big propaganda machine, they got years of experiences of hurting people, and they got every tricks in the book and never ever fail a battle they encounter….. And at the other corner, we got some naïve, silly civilians, they got no weapon, no experience, not much resources, no supporters and way out numbered, the only weapon is the so-call flg belief. The fight would be over before it gets started by looking at these contestants if I was the judge. Early in the fight, the communist came out from nowhere and threw the first punch and normally that should be more than enough, flg swallow it hard but amazingly didn’t get knocked out. It would take a miracle to win but Flg continue on with the fight for several years, and now is gaining some momentum. Hey people, if anybody is witnessing, you got give some credit to flg because they are the underdog, they got some awkward style, and they are putting the communist in defense.
Okay, all jokes aside, us Chinese don’t like violence and prefer peace, so why can’t them make peace with one another and it would be over? In my opinion, the initial gesture should be made by the communist; after all, they are the instigator and started