“True Pride” - Time magazine “真正的驕傲” -時代雜誌
Filed under: 提起下： media 媒體 | Tags: |標籤： nationalism 民族主義 , ， overseas 海外
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Money quotes:貨幣報價：
Just a few weeks ago, the west’s view of china was dominated by thuggish torch guards, hypersensitive nationalists and a repressive government.就在幾個星期前，西方的觀點，中國主要是thuggish火炬警衛，過敏症的民族主義者和鎮壓的政府。 But since the earthquake in Sichuan, the immense state-led rescue effort and the outpouring of charity from the Chinese people has taken center stage.但是，由於地震在四川，巨大的國家主導的救災工作和慈善機構源源不斷的從中國人民採取的中心舞台。 Has the country really changed that much?該國已真正改變多少？ Not really.並非如此。 The two phenomena on display — nationalism and compassion — are related facets of the vast, multidimensional nation that China is.這兩個現象顯示-民族主義和同情心-相關方面的巨大的，多方面的民族，中國是。 When it comes to my homeland, I feel them both.說到我的祖國，我覺得他們倆。
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But I became perplexed by the behavior of the supposedly neutral media.但是，我成為困惑的行為理應中立的媒體。 No report of China was ever complete without a mention of Tiananmen; no Chinese interviewee ever had anything positive to say about his or her life.沒有中國的報告是以往任何時候都完全沒有提及六四;沒有中國採訪過任何積極的表示他或她的生活。 It seemed to me that Western media were exclusively highlighting the worst side of China.在我看來，西方媒體只突出最嚴重的中國一側。My Western compatriots, normally so skeptical of the media, seemed to buy this depiction of China.我國西部的同胞，所以通常持懷疑態度的媒體，似乎購買這種描寫中國。 Friends would tell me in low, excited tones that they were going to China.朋友會告訴我低，興奮聲調，他們將中國。 Would they be arrested?他們會被逮捕？ No, I would say: Chinese criticize the government all the time.不，我要說：中國批評政府的所有時間。
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China is proud of its culture but also curious about other ones.中國感到自豪的是，它的文化，但也感到好奇其他的。 Chinese people genuinely regard the Olympics as a wonderful way to introduce the world to their home.中國人民真正把奧運會作為一個美妙的方式，介紹世界家園。 Opening your doors only to have them flung back in your face with misinformed and misguided moral disdain is deeply insulting.開幕式的大門只讓他們回到偏遠你的臉與錯誤和誤導性道德的蔑視深感侮辱。 The Western press and public opinion are filled with condescension toward China, and the attitude that the West alone knows what is best for all peoples.西方媒體和公眾輿論充滿了對中國屈尊和態度，西方國家僅知道什麼是最好的所有人民。
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Perhaps my views qualify me as a nationalist.也許我的意見我有資格作為一個民族。 Personally, I have always thought of myself as trying to understand China and explain what the Chinese point of view might be.就個人而言，我一直認為自己是試圖理解中國，並解釋了中國的觀點來看可能。 I have loved my international upbringing precisely because understanding — and appreciating — diverse cultural perspectives helps me overcome misconceptions, respect others and settle differences.我愛我的國際教育，正是因為理解-和讚賞-多元文化的角度幫助我克服誤解，尊重他人和解決分歧。 The Sichuan earthquake, tragic as it was, has shown the world the compassionate face of Chinese nationalism.四川地震，悲慘的，因為，已經顯示出世界的同情心面對中國的民族主義。 The human spirit underpins it and connects us all.人類的精神支撐和連接我們所有人。
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June 26th, 2008 at 12:13 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午12時13分
There is truly a lot about China that its patriots can be proud of, and I concede that there is occasional bias in the media, but I still have trouble understanding this:有的確是一個很多關於中國的愛國者，它可引以為自豪的，我承認，偶爾有偏見的媒體，但我仍然無法理解這一點：
“The Western press and public opinion are filled with condescension toward China” “西方新聞輿論充滿了對中國屈尊”
“It seemed to me that Western media were exclusively highlighting the worst side of China.” “這在我看來，西方媒體只突出最嚴重的中國一側。 ”
Has anyone ever thoroughly investigated the proportion of negative press about the Chinese government versus, say, negative press about the Russian government, or the American government?有任何人進行徹底調查比例的負面新聞對與中國政府，也就是說，負面新聞對俄羅斯政府，或美國政府？ In the media I read (mostly the British ’serious’ papers like the Guardian), I genuinely don’t think the Chinese government comes over any worse than the other governments.在我讀到媒體（主要是英國'嚴重'等文件衛） ，我真正不認為中國政府是任何低於其他國家的政府。
Furthermore, it is easy to show that the Western media pays far more attention to the shortcomings of societies it sees as similar to “the West”.此外，它很容易表明，西方媒體支付更多的關注社會的缺點它認為類似的“西方” 。 If Guantanamo Bay had been established by an African nation nobody would know about it.如果關塔那摩灣建立了一個非洲國家沒有人會知道。 That we now read about the Chinese governments shortcomings demonstrates, I think, that our media is coming to view China as ‘one of us’.我們現在看到的中國政府的缺點表明，我認為，我們的媒體是未來，以查看中國作為'是我們' 。
Therefore I maintain that the real bias is against Africa and India -it takes catastrophes and government failure of colossal scale before the our media can be convinced that the suffering of Africans is as equally newsworthy as that of Chinese or Americans.因此，我堅持認為，真正的偏見是對非洲和印度，它的災難和政府失敗的巨大規模之前，我們的媒體可以相信，苦難的非洲人同樣是新聞的是中國或美國人。
June 26th, 2008 at 2:50 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午02時50
Interestingly, the Time’s China blog also talked about this very article.有趣的是，時代的中國博客也談到這個文章。 And和 the post後 narrowly focused on how it was mistranslated into Chinese, while insinuating a deliberate attempt at distortion.狹義的重點是如何有人誤到中國，同時暗示蓄意歪曲。
So I went to the linked所以，我去聯繫 Chinese version中國版本 and found the “offending sentence”.並發現該“得罪一句。 ”
Gee, I would say it was probably just an innocent mistake.哎呀，我想說這或許只是一個無辜的錯誤。 The proper translation should be 这就是唯有西方正確的翻譯應該這就是唯有西方
唯一唯一知道知道的、的，什么最适合所有人的态度。 In essence, the word “only” needs to be moved to before “the west”, and a word “what” should be added. 什麼最適合所有人的態度 。從本質上說， “只有”一詞需要轉移到在“西部” ，和一個詞“什麼”應該增加。 That’s it.就是這樣。By the way, Austin Ramzy, in pointing out the mistranslation, mistranslated the Chinese version himself.順便說一下，奧斯汀Ramzy ，在指出了誤譯，誤了中國版本本人。
June 26th, 2008 at 2:55 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午02時55分
I think JL is right about Guardian.我認為，巨浪是正確的監護人。
But Guardian is a rarity these days, being a traditionally “left-winged” paper sympathetic to the socialists(?), i think.但衛是一個罕見的這些日子，作為一個傳統的“左翅”文件同情社會主義者（ ？ ） ，我想。 (and many people still assocaite China with socialism!!!, despite the fact that it is as capitalistic as the US) （和許多人仍然assocaite中國社會主義！ ，儘管事實上它是作為資本主義的美國）
i guess if we do a fair/random sampling one would find:我想如果我們不公平/隨機抽樣的人會發現：
1) guadian/asahi/LA Times has much smaller market share than ‘the rest’ 1 ）瓜迪安/旭/洛杉磯時報有很多較小的市場份額比'其他'
2) british papers are, in general, more critical and more focused in facts compared with, eg the american (eg, cnn/wsj/nyt — which are most US-centric and, perhaps mainly for commercial reasons, tend to use stereotypical description to appeal to its readers more often), which has much larger market share. 2 ）英國論文，一般而言，更重要和更集中的事實相比，例如，美國（例如，美國有線新聞網/華爾街日報/紐約-這是大多數美國為中心，也許主要是出於商業目的，往往使用定型描述呼籲它的讀者更經常地） ，其中有更大的市場份額。
June 26th, 2008 at 3:31 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午03時31分
Sunbin, Sunbin ，
I think your interpretation of the American press is dead on.我想你解釋，美國媒體就已經死了。 There definitely is some stereotyping going around.肯定是有一些成見去了。 That’s just lazy journalism imo.這只是懶惰新聞海事組織。
June 26th, 2008 at 3:43 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午03時43分
I’d say that the western media giving larger coverage on China than on India or Africa does not mean that they have less bias against China.我想指出，西方媒體給予更大的覆蓋範圍上比中國對印度或非洲並不意味著他們較少對中國的偏見。 There is always substantial economic and political reason, the national interests that underline or dictate whatever they find “newsworthy.”總是有大量的經濟和政治的原因，國家的利益，強調或規定不管他們找到“新聞” 。
The western mdeia’s bias against China is deeply ingrained, and you can feel this even from reading the articles published by the so called liberal journalists plus “China experts” from left-leaning newspapers and journals (such as The Guardian).西部mdeia的對中國的偏見是根深蒂固的，你可以認為這甚至從閱讀的文章發表的所謂自由派記者加上“中國專家”左傾報紙和期刊（如衛） 。 Not long ago and even today some politicians or think-tank scholars in the US would carelessly use “communist China” in their China articles and interviews.不久前，甚至今天一些政客或智庫學者，美國將不小心使用“中國共產黨”在中國的文章和訪談。 On web discussion forums even a moderate explanation of facts in clarifying the senseless attack on Chinese government would be commonly called being CCP apologist by western netizens.論網絡論壇的討論甚至溫和解釋，澄清事實，毫無意義的攻擊中國政府將通常被稱為是中共辯護士西方網民。 The Prejudice against China has taken more sophisticated and subtler forms in recently years as more and more of journalists and academia are able to have first hand experience in China but nevertheless it is rooted in the Pride (a cultural imperialism which says my set of values is superior than yours and therefore my perception of reality in China is more accurate than yours).在對中國偏見採取了更加複雜和微妙的形式在最近幾年隨著越來越多的記者和學術界能夠有第一手經驗，但在中國仍然是植根於傲慢（一文化帝國主義這表示我的一套價值觀念是優於你，因此我的看法在中國的現實是更精確的比你） 。 Some of them would take as personal insult if you say he or she does not understand China in such and such issues.其中有些人將個人的侮辱，如果你說他或她不明白中國的這樣或那樣的問題。 The Cold War mentality is also a factor, almost a fixation of western sensibility, unmovable like a mountain.冷戰思維也是一個因素，幾乎是固定的西部感覺， unmovable像一座山。
June 26th, 2008 at 4:05 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午四點05
I have no beef with patriotism, per se.我沒有牛肉愛國主義，本身並沒有問題。 But Chinese patriotism is particularly thin-skinned, angry, frightened, and exclusive.但是，中國的愛國主義尤其薄皮，憤怒，害怕，排斥。 It’s true that China is frequently the target of criticism in the western press, but who isn’t?的確，中國是經常的批評對象在西方新聞界，但誰不是？ Moreover, are the US and Japan treated any better by the Chinese media?此外，正在美國和日本對待任何好轉的中國媒體？ How many times during the last eight years (ie, since George W. Bush first took office) have French or German politicians insulted the US?多少次在過去的8年（即自布什上任）有法語或德語的政治家侮辱了美國？ Do Americans respond by taking to the streets in protest, angrily demanding apologies, and threatening boycotts?美國人不要作出反應，採取街頭抗議，憤怒地要求道歉，並威脅抵制？ In fact, contrary to the Ms. Liu’s assertion, I see much less condescension in the western media’s treatment of China than I do in the Chinese media’s treatment of the US and Japan.事實上，這違背了柳女士的說法，我看到少得多屈尊在西方媒體對待中國，你比我在中國媒體的治療美國和日本。 By way of example, I remember buying a newspaper in Beijing three or four years ago - the front page headline read (in Chinese) “The US A Danger To World Peace”.舉個例子，我記得買了報紙在北京三，四年前-頭版標題改為（在中國） “美國的威脅世界和平” 。 Likewise, on September 18 of last year (ie, the anniversary of Japan’s invasion of Manchuria in 1931) I watched a Beijing television reporter interview a 7 or 8 year old elementary school student.同樣，在9月18日去年（即週年之際，日本入侵滿洲國於1931年） ：我觀看了北京電視台記者採訪了7或8歲的小學生。 When asked about the significance of the anniversary, the student replied that he didn’t know very much, just that the Japanese were very bad because they invaded China sometime in the past and killed many Chinese.當被問到的意義週年之際，學生回答說，他不知道，非常公正，日本是非常糟糕的，因為他們的某個入侵中國在過去和殺害了很多中國。 Great stuff.大的東西。 Very patriotic.非常愛國。 I suppose that if you’re Chinese, that’s all you really need to know.我猜想，如果您是中國，這是所有你真正需要知道的。 Fair treatment?公平的待遇？ Hardly.很難。 On an almost daily basis, I find the most outrageous, vitriolic, bombastic, and conspiratorial crap about the US offered up as news in China.幾乎每天，我覺得最荒謬的，尖刻，嘐，垃圾和陰謀對美國提供的作為在中國的新聞。 (While modest, legitimate criticism of the ruling regime is nonexistent.) （雖然不大，合理的批評執政的制度是不存在的。 ）
The truth about the western media is that it thrives on conflict and crisis.真相的西方媒體是它滋生的衝突和危機。 The protests surrounding the torch relay, for example, is news.抗議周圍的火炬接力，例如，是新聞。 Crowds of happy Chinese supporters are not news - at least not until they become angry and start beating up China’s critics.觀眾高興中國的支持者不是新聞-至少沒有，直到他們變得憤怒，並開始打中國的批評。 Perhaps many Chinese would be surprised to learn that westerners frequently express the opinion that the media is too negative.也許很多中國將驚訝地得知，西方人常常表示認為，媒體是過於消極。 Even so, such negativity sells, and sells well.即便如此，這種消極銷售，並銷售良好。 As the saying goes, “If it bleeds, it leads.” Get used to it.常言道， “如果它出血，它的潛在客戶。 ”已經習慣了。 And stop your whining.停止你的牢騷。
June 26th, 2008 at 4:31 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午04點31
@Ma Bole, @馬伯樂，
You are kidding yourself for being so ignorant of the prevalent media bias in the west and attitude of condescension or even hostility towards China among many prominent media figures such as Jack Cafferty (who calls Chinese “goons and thugs”) and Lou Dubbs (who refuses to refer to China as “China”, but always as “Communist China”).你是在開玩笑讓自己如此愚昧的偏見流行的媒體在西部和恩賜的態度，甚至敵視中國的許多著名媒體的數字，如傑克Cafferty （誰呼籲中國“ goons和惡棍” ）和樓Dubbs （誰拒絕提及中國的“中國” ，但總是因為“共產黨中國” ） 。
I am extremely pleased that Jiajia Liu wrote such an eloquent piece on a fairly complex subject for a person of her age and experience.我非常高興佳佳劉寫這樣一個雄辯的一塊相當複雜的問題一個人她的年齡和經驗。 She did take advantage of her life experience and her unique background as a Chinese living in the west.她利用她的生活經驗和她獨特的背景作為一個生活在中國西部。 I wish that my daughter will be able to have such enlightened perspective and write something like this when she grows up.我希望我的女兒將能夠有如此開明的觀點，並寫這樣的事情當她長大。
June 26th, 2008 at 4:41 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午04時41分
Ma Bole,馬伯樂，
Please try read my following comment to you in a friendly tone:請嘗試閱讀我以下評論你在友好的基調：
Just look at your rant!只要看看你的言論！ Perhaps you should consider take some of the medicine you suggested to the “whining” Chinese for yourself.也許你應該考慮採取一些醫學您提出的“牢騷”中國為自己。
June 26th, 2008 at 5:06 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午05時06分
@JL, @巨浪，
Have you always been this reasonable?你一直是這合理嗎？ I mean that, I think you pose a good question.我的意思是說，我想你帶來一個很好的問題。
The truth is, people have always blamed media bias.事實是，人民一直指責媒體的偏見。 Those familiar with American politics should be well-aware of the growing divide between, say, “liberal media” and Fox News.熟悉美國政治應該充分認識到之間的鴻溝越來越多，說， “自由的媒體”和福克斯新聞台。 In Taiwan, the leading Taiwanese Independence website is actually called “Anti-Media”… I think that should tell you something; they spend all of their time railing against what they call the “unification media”.在台灣，導致台灣獨立的網站實際上是所謂的“反媒體” ...我認為應該告訴你，他們花費所有的時間欄杆對他們所說的“統一的媒體” 。 I’m sure similar criticisms exist in Europe.我敢肯定存在著類似的批評在歐洲。
I think there’s good reason for in this, and also a little exaggeration.我認為有很好的理由在此，也有點誇張。 The truth is, media do have specific perspectives.事實是，媒體也有具體的觀點。 Obviously, articles can be written with a biased perception… the recent顯然，文章可以寫有偏見的看法最近... series of Olympics-related articles一系列的奧運相關文章 in the NY Times fall in that category, I think.在紐約時報屬於這一類，我想。 And even if their articles and analysis are completely factual, they can be biased just on the basis of how they choose the stories they pursue.即使他們的文章和分析完全是事實，他們可以有偏見，公正的基礎上，他們如何選擇，他們追求的故事。
There is also exaggeration, because I don’t think this is done intentionally (in almost all cases).也有誇張，因為我不認為這是蓄意進行的（在幾乎所有情況下） 。 I don’t think editors necessarily have an agenda.我不認為編輯必然有一個議程。 And when people complain about “liberal” versus “conservative” media, the moderates who spend the time to watch more than one TV channel will usually get a balanced perspective.當人們抱怨“自由”還是“保守”的媒體，溫和派誰花時間收看多個電視頻道通常會獲得一個平衡的觀點。
But China is a special case.但是，中國是一個特例。 There is no Fox News channel to provide a “fair and balanced” perspective on the Chinese government. 沒有福克斯新聞頻道提供了“公正和平衡”的角度對中國政府。 The debate in Western editorial pages tends to be how evil and hopeless the Chinese government is, rather than an informed discussion of whether it’s evil at all.這場辯論在西方編輯的網頁往往是多麼邪惡和絕望，中國政府的，而不是一個知情的討論，無論是邪惡的。 And this is the part that really angers many Chinese: the result is a Western public that has an incredibly warped, twisted view of Chinese society.這是一部分，真正激怒許多中國： 其結果是西方的市民，已經令人難以置信的扭曲，扭曲鑑於中國的社會。
Other than the most ardent liberals, few Americans would take at face value an editorial written by Saddam Hussein’s former information minister criticizing George Bush’s foreign policy… they know the other side of the story here.除了最忠實的自由主義者，幾個美國人將在票面價值的社論撰寫的薩達姆侯賽因的前新聞部長批評布什的外交政策...他們知道對方的故事在這裡。
But when it comes to China, no one bats an eyelash when Rebiya Kadeer or the Dalai Lama’s envoy writes an equally biased editorial for the Washington Post… because they simply don’t know the other side of the story.但是在中國，沒有一個蝙蝠的睫毛時，熱比婭或達賴喇嘛的特使寫一個同樣有偏見的社論華盛頓郵報...因為他們完全不知道對方的故事。 As someone who’s seen what people on the streets say (or at least type online)… they really, really do not know the other side of the story on China.正如有人誰是看到人們在街上說（或至少型在線） ...他們真的，真的不知道另一邊的中國故事。 I’ve talked about this before, in reference to the Olympic torch.我已經討論過這個之前，在提及奧運火炬。
The biggest reaction amongst average Americans after Chinese crowds turned out to “defend” the torch was complete shock: you mean there are Chinese people who actually support the Olympics?最大的反應之間的美國人平均後中國人群成為“保護”的火炬已完成休克：你的意思是中國人民食堂誰實際支持奧運會？ You mean there are people who don’t believe Tibet is a country invaded in 1950, in which the Chinese government is committing genocide?你的意思是有些人誰不認為西藏是一個國家入侵於1950年，在中國政府正在犯下種族滅絕？ (This of course led to the follow-on question: are all these Chinese brain-washed, or are they being paid? But I’ll take this as progress.) （當然，這導致了後續的問題：這些都是中國腦洗，或者他們支付？但我會以此作為取得進展。 ）
The fact that this shock exists is more than sufficient proof, for me, of persistent and systematic media bias.事實上，這是休克存在以上足以證明對我來說，持久性和系統性媒體的偏見。 I’m glad Time published Ms. Liu’s editorial… when average Americans at least know this perspective exists (even if they don’t share with it), then I’ll say the bias has finally disappeared.我很高興出版時間劉女士的社論...當美國人平均至少知道這個觀點存在（即使他們沒有分享它） ，然後我會說的偏見終於消失了。
June 26th, 2008 at 5:10 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午5點10
BBC ran an article about a report by the Chinese government detailing the ratio of negative and positive news about China.英國廣播公司跑一篇文章的一份報告，詳細說明中國政府的比率消極和積極的消息，中國。 I cannot find the news now, but I think the government keeps a tally.我無法找到的消息，但我認為政府保持紀錄。
One thing I think about western media is that they are overrated.有一件事我想對西方媒體的是，他們高估。
And the solution to this prejudice is not closeness, but rather openness.而解決這一影響並不親近，而是開放的。
June 26th, 2008 at 5:14 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午5時14分
Buxi, Buxi ，
I would also add that there is a kind of ideas monopoly and peer pressure going on.我還想補充一點，有一種思想的壟斷和同儕壓力事情。 If you dare to express anything but “canonical” views on topics like TAM or Tibet, chances are you will be shouted down as a panda hugger or communist sympathizer.如果你不敢表達什麼，但“規範”意見的議題像譚或西藏，您將下台作為一個大熊貓混亂或共產主義同情者。 This happens in news and also in conversations, and you get this from both the left and the right in the US.這發生在新聞，並在交談，你得到這兩個左派和右派在美國。 The bias is that deep.偏見是深。 The atmosphere is that dead.這裡的氣氛是 ，死了。 It’s that kind of closed-mindedness that shackles people from even thinking there is an “other side”.這是那種封閉意識的束縛人們思想，甚至是“另一邊” 。
June 26th, 2008 at 5:32 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午05點32
I’ve said it before in other forums, but I say it again.我已經說過它之前在其他論壇，但我再說一遍。 I look forward to the day when ignorant buffoons like Jack Cafferty of CNN can criticize China and China’s government and people won’t feel compelled to respond - or will choose to respond by saying something like, “Great men do not bear grudges against petty men” (大人不記小人過) or “Ivory does not grow from the mouths of dogs” (狗嘴裏長不出象牙來).我期待著有朝一日像無知buffoons傑克Cafferty有線電視新聞網可以批評中國和中國政府和人民不會感到有必要回應-或將選擇回應說，像“大男人不承擔對積怨小男人“ （大人不記小人過）或”不科特迪瓦增長從嘴巴的狗“ （狗嘴裡長不出象牙來） 。 It is unseemly for the government of a country as important and influential as China to lower itself to the level of an ignorant nobody like Jack Cafferty.這是不適當的政府對一個國家的重要和有影響力的中國，以降低自己的水平沒有一個無知像傑克Cafferty 。 The result?結果如何呢？ Cafferty wins and China loses. Cafferty勝中國輸家。 Lesson learned?教訓？ Probably not.也許不能。
To those of you who disagreed with my first post, I say again, quit whining and demanding apologies.那些你誰不同意我的第一篇文章，我再說一遍，退出牢騷，並要求道歉。 So your feelings are hurt.所以你的感情是傷害。 Big deal.大問題。 China and its people must learn to take it on the chin like real men.中國及其人民必須學會考慮它的下巴像真正的男人。 你們的臉皮太薄了.你們的臉皮太薄了。
To be sure, freedom of speech is a bitch.可以肯定的是，言論自由是一個婊子。 People frequently take advantage of it to express all kinds of ignorant, hurtful, misguided, and misleading ideas.人們經常利用它來表達各種無知，傷害，錯誤的，誤導的想法。 Just as often, they use it to express truth to power.正如通常，他們用它來表達真相的權力。 More importantly, freedom of speech raises the quality of a people by making them tolerant of ideas other than their own.更重要的是，言論自由的質量提高了人民，使他們的思想寬容本國以外。 China and the Chinese could use a bit more freedom of speech, I think.中國和中國可以利用更多的言論自由，我想。
Let the attacks begin.讓我們的攻擊開始。
June 26th, 2008 at 5:35 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午5時35分
hotshotdebut, et al hotshotdebut ，等
I don’t even think the number of “negative” stories matter either.我什至不認為一些“消極”的故事不是問題。 IMO, true criticism points out good and bad qualities, you basically call it like you see it, and personally, that’s fine with me.海事組織，真正的批評指出，好的和壞的品質，你要求它基本上像你看到的那樣，和個人，這是我的罰款。 I know other posters here would agree with that sentiment because, hey, what’s wrong with that, you are pointing out flaws or things that can be improved, the media is being a watchdog, that’s good.我知道其他的海報在這裡也同意這一觀點，因為，嘿，有什麼不對的，你指出的缺陷或東西，可以加以改進，媒體是監督，這是很好的。 However, that is based on the assumption that the “negative” stories are FAIR criticisms.然而，這是基於假設，即“消極”的故事是公平的批評。
If journalists are stereotyping or pigeonholing issues related to China, then they are not being fair and that is where I have my issues with.如果記者的成見或pigeonholing有關問題的中國，那麼他們是不公平，這是在我有我的問題。 I’ll repeat it again, it’s lazy journalism.我會再次重複，這是懶惰的新聞。
June 26th, 2008 at 5:45 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午05點45分
@Ma Bole, @馬伯樂，
I think you’re missing the point, and the existence of this blog as well as many of the events you observed prove your conclusion wrong.我認為你是錯過了點，存在這個博客以及許多的事件你觀察證明你的結論是錯誤的。
- this blog, and many other similar Internet arguments, exists because many Chinese patriots are tired of “complaining” and “whining” about Jack Cafferty’s comments. -此博客，和其他許多類似互聯網的論點，因為存在著許多中國的愛國者已厭倦的“抱怨”和“牢騷”的傑克C afferty的意見。 I’m done having hurt feelings.我做了傷害感情。 The only one to win the debate in Western terms is to engage in the debate, and that’s what we’re here for.只有贏得辯論中西方術語進行了辯論，這就是我們正在這裡。
- many Chinese patriots also understand that when talking nice doesn’t work, a slap to the face is the only way to get attention. -許多中國愛國主義者也明白，交談時沒有很好的工作，打了一耳光的臉只有這樣，才能得到重視。 Free Tibet protesters understood that in London and France, and as you saw in every subsequent city, we heard the message loud and clear.自由西藏抗議者了解，在倫敦和法國，並作為你看到在每一個城市以後，我們聽到的信息響亮而明確的。
So, Chinese patriotism isn’t always “thin-skinned”, “frightened”, although sometimes we can be “angry”.因此，中國的愛國主義並非總是“薄皮” ， “害怕” ，雖然有時我們可以“憤怒” 。 We are certainly not complaining and whining.我們當然不會抱怨和牢騷。 We, as Chinese patriots, are here planning, discussing, educating, and debating.我們作為中國的愛國志士，在這裡的規劃，討論，教育，進行辯論。 We welcome all takers (although preferably the reasonable ones).我們歡迎所有者（但最好是合理的） 。
Get used to it.已經習慣了。
June 26th, 2008 at 6:05 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06點05分
Nimrod,尼姆羅德
I think your point on ideas monopoly and peer pressure is a good one.我想你一點想法壟斷和同儕壓力是好的。 And one should take a look at what happened in the Duke university to appreciate the damage of such things.一要看看發生在美國杜克大學欣賞損害這種事情。 No no no I wasn’t talking about Grace Wang, but rather the infamous false rape accusation against the Duke lacrosse team and its fallout.沒有沒有沒有，我不是在談論格雷斯王，而是臭名昭著的假強姦指控杜克大學長曲棍球的球隊及其影響。 Regarding that case, the writings by KC Johnson at his Durham in Wonderland blog are well worth a read.關於這種情況下，著作由架KC約翰遜在他的達勒姆仙境博客非常值得一讀。 Johnson particularly hammered at the ugly and despicable words and behaviors of those “progressive” professors and their enablers (and their unrepentant stances to this day).約翰遜特別是在敲定的醜惡和卑鄙的言論和行為的那些“進步”的教授和他們的手段（及其執迷不悟立場，這一天） 。 One of the key themes of the criticisms was on how ideas monopoly and peer pressure of all those involved contributed to this fiasco.其中一個關鍵主題的批評是如何思想的壟斷和同儕壓力對所有那些參與促成了這一慘敗。
Come to think of it, I have to say that those professors’ thought pattern and expressions remind me strongly of a significant portion of the anti-China voices all over the places in the west.來想想看，我必須說，這些教授的思維模式和表現形式提醒我強烈的有很大一部分是反中國的呼聲所有的地方在西部地區。
June 26th, 2008 at 6:07 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06點07分
@DJ, @的DJ ，
Great catch on the mistranslation… I actually found the article through their blog too.漁獲量大的誤譯...事實上，我發現文章通過他們的博客了。 I knew they were insinuating *something*, but gave up trying to figure out what.我知道他們有什麼暗示* * ，但放棄了試圖找出什麼。 Hope you hope over there and correct them on it.希望你希望在那裡和糾正它。
June 26th, 2008 at 6:07 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06點07分
Sites like this exist largely to complain about the unfairness of the western media.像這樣的網站存在的主要抱怨不公平的西方媒體。 Both those who write the main posts and many of those who respond to them fixate on the western media’s alleged unfair treatment of China without ever bothering to examine the western media’s treatment of other issues.無論是誰寫的主要職位和許多人誰應對這些固定的西方媒體所謂不公正待遇的中國沒有任何打擾，審查西方媒體對待其他問題。 This is patently whining.這顯然是牢騷。 On any given day, CNN, the New York Times, the BBC, Le Monde, and the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung - just to name a few - spend much more time criticizing their own governments and each other than they do criticizing China.在某一天，美國有線新聞網，紐約時報，英國廣播公司，世界報和法蘭克福匯報-剛剛僅舉幾例-花更多的時間，批評自己的政府和彼此的時間要多於批評中國。 Spare me the protests.備件箱的抗議活動。 The lack of freedom of speech has rendered the Chinese a people hardly capable of listening to foreign criticism, much less considering it.由於缺乏言論自由已使中國人幾乎能夠收聽外國的批評，更不用說考慮。 And in so far as the relative merits of the western and Chinese media go, the West wins hands down.在迄今為止的相對優點的西部和中國的媒體去，西勝手了。 Recent news of the CCP’s renewed efforts to tighten its control of the Chinese media (http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/bda7cc42-4206-11dd-a5e8-0000779fd2ac.html?nclick_check=1) as well as its efforts to indimidate western scholars who publish on sensitive topics (http://chinadigitaltimes.net/2008/06/want-access-go-easy-on-china/) are proof enough of this.最近的消息，中共新的努力，加強其控制的中國媒體（ http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/bda7cc42-4206-11dd-a5e8-0000779fd2ac.html?nclick_check=1 ）以及努力indimidate西方學者對誰發布敏感話題（ http://chinadigitaltimes.net/2008/06/want-access-go-easy-on-china/ ）是足以證明這一點。 Your highminded defense of your blog, notwithstanding, you spend far too much time combatting the foreign media than you do fighting the larger fight against the predations of the CCP.您highminded國防您的博客，儘管如此，您花太多時間打擊外國媒體比你更大的戰鬥打擊predations中共。 You are nothing less than a flag-waver and an apologist.你只不過是不到國旗的動搖和辯護士。
June 26th, 2008 at 6:22 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06點22分
Buxi, Buxi ，
Seems I would be late to hop over and comment on the Time blog now.看來，我將晚，跳過去，就現在的時間博客。 I just saw that someone by the name Lemean already had the following:我剛才看到的某人的名字Lemean已經如下：
June 26th, 2008 at 6:27 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06時27分
bu xi不喜
all due respect but you are an American citizen and are in no way representative of the Chinese patriots that Ma Bole writes about.所有應有的尊重，但你是一名美國公民，並絕不代表中國的愛國者，馬伯樂寫的。 If you were here on the ground in China you would immediately see that Chinese patriots are not the slightest bit interested in ‘educating’ and ‘debating’, rather that complaining, whining and boycotting this and that are the order of the day.如果你是在此間舉行的中國地面您將立即看到，中國的愛國者是沒有絲毫興趣有點'教育'和'辯論' ，而是抱怨，牢騷和抵制這一點，並有秩序的一天。
thanks謝謝
tommy湯米
June 26th, 2008 at 6:33 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06點33
Ma Bole,馬伯樂，
Thanks for proving me right with name-calling.感謝證明我的權利，罵人。 But we can really use less of that, keep that in mind.但是，我們才能真正使用更少的，記住這一點。
tommydickfingers, tommydickfingers ，
Now why do you get to pick who the “patriots” are?現在，你為什麼會挑選誰是“愛國者”是什麼？ Why is it that we don’t represent them, rather than that they don’t represent us?為什麼我們不能代表他們，而不是他們並不代表我們嗎？ By the way, even in the raucous crowds, some people held up well made signs and posters to get their point across.順便說一下，即使是在喧鬧擁擠的人群，一些人舉行了良好的跡象和海報，以獲得跨越點。 Good job for being blind to that.做好被無視這一點。
June 26th, 2008 at 6:41 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06時41分
@Nimrod @尼姆羅德
My “name-calling” is descriptive.我的“罵人”是說明性的。 A bit like referring to someone who rapes people as a “rapist”.有點像有人提到誰強姦人民的“強姦犯” 。
June 26th, 2008 at 6:52 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06時52
@tommydickfingers, @ tommydickfingers ，
First of all, I’ma Chinese citizen.首先，我是中國公民。 (And China doesn’t recognize dual citizenships; I’m certainly not an American citizen.) （而中國不承認雙重國籍;我肯定不是一個美國公民。 ）
Second of all, I rather like the attitude shown in these第二，我比較喜歡表現出的態度在這些 quotes from Xi Jingping引號，習近平 (on a visit to Qatar) this week: （在訪問卡塔爾）本星期：
Damn straight.哎呀連敗。 Less complaining about the hurt feelings of the Chinese people, and more determination on the path we will take.少抱怨傷害感情，中國人民和更大的決心的道路上我們將採取。
June 26th, 2008 at 6:52 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06時52
Ma Bole,馬伯樂，
Regarding your protest:關於你的抗議：
Perhaps I shouldn’t bother to point out the classic logic flaw in your first sentence.也許我不應該打擾指出，經典的邏輯漏洞在您的第一句。 So I won’t.所以，我不會。
Instead, some questions:相反，一些問題：
Why do you believe that there is such a thing as a “larger fight”?為什麼你認為有這樣的事，作為一個“大打擊” ？ And if there is one, why should it be against the CCP?如果有一個，為什麼應該是針對中共？ Why do you assume that it is a settled matter that the most important and most beneficial thing for China and the Chinese people is to fight the CCP?為什麼你承擔，這是一個解決問題的最重要和最有益的事情中國與中國人民對抗中共？ Where did you gain the confidence in knowing things would be better in China without the CCP?你在哪裡有信心知道事情會得到更好的在中國沒有共產黨？
Maybe it’s because you don’t care about the consequences if things could get worse, or there would be little chance for it to get better.也許是因為你不在乎的後果如果事情可能變得更糟，或將有可能性不大它變得更好。
June 26th, 2008 at 6:56 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06點56分
Blog on this:博客在此：
Beijing blocked access within China to “In the Hepatitis B Camp,” a popular website and online forum for carriers of the virus and which was the world’s biggest such forum with over 300,000 members.北京封鎖在中國，以“在B型肝炎營” ，熱門網站和網上論壇，病毒的攜帶者和這是世界上最大的此類論壇的成員超過300000 。 China’s 120m carriers of the virus are widely discriminated against by companies, universities and some government departments, even though the virus cannot be spread through casual contact.中國的一二○米病毒的攜帶者廣泛歧視的公司，大學和一些政府部門，即使病毒無法傳播通過偶然接觸。
(http://chinadigitaltimes.net/2008/06/group-warns-china-on-website-shutdown/) （ http://chinadigitaltimes.net/2008/06/group-warns-china-on-website-shutdown/ ）
Lots to feel proud of there!抽籤感到自豪了！
June 26th, 2008 at 6:59 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午06時59
I’m of the firm opinion that we can better evaluate someone on the basis of what he says, than what is said about him.我堅定地認為，我們可以更好地評價別人的基礎上，他所說的話，而不是什麼是對他說。
Reading Nimrod, DJ, and Ma Bole’s posts above… well, I’m certainly biased, but the contrast seems obvious.讀尼姆羅德的DJ ，馬伯樂的帖子上面...好，我當然有偏見的，但相比之下似乎很明顯。 Ma Bole, I think your accusatory posts reflect more of your own inadequacies, than any ability to “score points”.馬伯樂，我認為你的指責員額更多地反映自己的不足之處，比任何能力“得分” 。
June 26th, 2008 at 7:00 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午7:00
@Ma Bole, @馬伯樂，
The forum is still available here:此次論壇仍然可以在這裡： http://www.hbvhbv.com/forum/
I have no problems accessing it.我沒有問題存取。
June 26th, 2008 at 7:00 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午7:00
@DJ @的DJ
My degrees are in History, not philosophy.我國學位的歷史，而不是哲學。 I would, in fact, appreciate it if you’d point out the “classic logic flaw” in my comment.我想，事實上，讚賞如果您想指出， “經典邏輯漏洞”在我的評論。 Thanks in advance.在此先感謝。
June 26th, 2008 at 7:05 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午07點05分
I just MSN-ed a friend in Beijing.我剛才的MSN版的朋友在北京舉行。 She says that she cannot access the forum from her computer at Peking University but will continue trying.她說，她無法訪問該論壇從她的計算機上北大，但將繼續努力。
June 26th, 2008 at 7:13 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午07時13分
Ma Bole,馬伯樂，
Your logic is as follows: “you are wrong to你的邏輯如下： “你是錯誤的
should/can not應/不能fight one wrong because you are not fighting another wrong (or all wrongs).”一個錯誤的鬥爭，因為你不戰鬥又一個錯誤（或所有的錯誤） 。 “June 26th, 2008 at 7:14 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午07點14分
The forum has numerous posts, today, from users claiming to be in Beijing.該論壇有許多職位，今天，從用戶聲稱要在北京舉行。 For example:例如：
http://www.hbvhbv.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=731946&extra=page%3D1 http://www.hbvhbv.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=731946&extra=page ％ 3D1
We can discuss this topic and the false report on that forum in a different thread.我們可以討論這一議題和虛假報告的這一論壇在不同的線程。 But I don’t really like the way you’ve hijacked the thread into a tangential topic that has absolutely nothing to do with what we’re discussing here.但是我真的不喜歡你的線程被劫持到切話題，絕對沒有任何關係與我們這裡討論。
Americans, British, French, and Chinese can be proud of their country despite whatever many flaws it may still have.美國，英國，法國，和中國可以引為自豪的國家，儘管許多缺陷無論它可能依然存在。 As one American patriot said: “My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right.”正如一位美國的愛國者說： “我的國家，無論對錯，如果權利，保持正確的，如果錯了，確定正確的。 ”
We’re not here to claim China is flawless, nor are we here to claim that China is always right.我們這裡不是為了索賠中國是完美的，也不是我們在這裡宣稱，中國永遠是對的。 But even as the Chinese go about the task of setting China right, we must also distinguish between what is actually right, and what is actually wrong.但是，即使作為中國去的任務是制定中國的權利，我們還必須區分什麼是真正的權利，哪些實際上是錯誤的。 If you’re interested in debating that process, stay.如果您有興趣在辯論的過程中，留下來。 Otherwise, find somewhere else to vent.否則，找到別的地方發洩。
EDIT: By the way:編輯：順便說一下：
Makes me think you don’t read this blog at all.讓我覺得你沒有閱讀此博客在所有。 Go down the list on the right side of your screen.去的名單右側的屏幕上。 There are 15 blog entries there.有15個博客條目存在。 Scan through, do the math, and tell me how many of them “complain about the unfairness of the Western media”.通過掃描，這樣做的數學，並告訴我，其中有多少“抱怨不公平的西方媒體” 。
June 26th, 2008 at 7:34 am 2008年6月二十六日在上午07時34分
Many overseas Chinese have been living in the west for years and well know about the western media’s nature of criticizing and well know how often the media criticize China .Overseas Chinese had never gone to the street to protest the media bias and criticism before.許多海外中國人一直生活在西部的幾年以及了解西方媒體的性質批評以及知道如何媒體常常批評中國。海外中國從來沒有去街頭，抗議媒體的偏見和批評面前。 my personal feeling is early this year we went on the streets was because the bias was just too much and seemed well coordinated and was bashing China’s national pride everywhere in front of the whole world.我個人的感覺是今年初，我們去的街道上，是因為偏見只是太多，似乎很好的協調，並抨擊中國的民族自豪感，無處不在前面的整個世界。 It was crossed the line .這是越過球門線。
I agree with the criticizing nature of west media while at the same time I also agree the bias towards China is very deep and some time caused by ignorance and other time are politically motivated.我同意批評性質的西部大媒體同時我也同意了偏向中國是非常深刻和一段時間所造成的無知和其他時間是出於政治動機。
When people agree with media complaining, whining and boycotting China because is selling weapons to Zimbabwe , have people ever checked is China the biggest weapon supplier to African countries當人們同意媒體抱怨，抱怨和抵制，因為中國出售武器是津巴布韋，人們以往任何時候都檢查是中國最大的武器供應商，向非洲國家
Is China the biggest buyer of Sudan’s oil ?中國是最大的買主，蘇丹的石油？ Dose Japan buy much less oil from Sudan.日本購買的劑量少得多的石油來自蘇丹。